#ISEDchat Archive | Participate

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:00 PM EDT

Welcome to #isedchat! Tonight we are discussing Student Effort. Please introduce yourself and tell us your role at your school.

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:01 PM EDT

Hey, Lorri. Mark Crotty, head of St. John's Episcopal in Dallas. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:02 PM EDT

@crottymark Hi Mark! How goes it in Dallas? It's been so cold in CT and we even had a snow delay on Monday. #isedchat.

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:02 PM EDT

Rob from St. John's in Dallas. 8th grade T and secondary school placement coordinator #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:03 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 Opposite extreme here--almost 90 today! #isedchat

ckoos1 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:03 PM EDT

Cath Koos, Head of Lower School at Holy Trinity in Melbourne, FL. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:03 PM EDT

@ckoos1 Hi Cathy! And I am jealous of your climate, too! #isedchat

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:04 PM EDT

Howdy #isedchat! Mike from NA in NJ :) Upper school mathematics T. Howdy #isedchat!

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:04 PM EDT

Howdy #isedchat! Mike from NA in NJ :) Upper school mathematics T. Howdy #isedchat!

ckoos1 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:04 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 Perfect day today. Sunny, but not too hot. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:04 PM EDT

@mthayer_nj Hi Mike! Thanks for joining us. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:04 PM EDT

Hi, #isedchat! Bill Ivey, Middle School Dean at @sbschoolorg. Fending off my cat from my pizza and trying to arrange music. :-)

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:04 PM EDT

Q1 coming up in 1 minute! #Isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:05 PM EDT

@bivey Hi Bill! Great to "see" you! #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:05 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 @ckoos1 What, Lorri? You are not enjoying our gorgeous New England spring? #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:05 PM EDT

Q1. What does “good effort” look like to you? #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:06 PM EDT

@bivey @ckoos1 Not so much... we didn't have winter during winter and now we have it during spring! #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:06 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 Good to "see" you too! No exercise tonight - we had (an awesome) Poetry Festival so I came straight home and am free. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:06 PM EDT

A1 Manifests in different ways that you can tell if one is really engaged. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:07 PM EDT

@crottymark Can you give some examples? #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:07 PM EDT

A1: willingness to have a go and not worry about grade/outcomes necessarily #isedchat

ckoos1 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:08 PM EDT

A1: Ss engaged and on topic. If experiences a setback, looks to see what he/she can do differently. Doesn't blame others. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:08 PM EDT

A1 Students are engaged, participating, they ask good questions. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:08 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 The furrowed brow, certain gleam in the eyes, bursts of activity. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:08 PM EDT

A1 Honestly, I think it's very difficult to see *effort*, never mind judge it's quality. You can see *results* more easily. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:09 PM EDT

@bivey And often the results can hide the true effort, i.e. great writing looks easy. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:10 PM EDT

A1 Like, I know the bassist in the "Wait for the Moment" group sounds super incredible, and it's a demanding technical part... #isedchat

ckoos1 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:10 PM EDT

I like the asking ?s part. So disappointing when a student doesn't ask a ? when they have one. #isedchat https://t.co/nL3N6GNbxL

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:08 PM EDT

A1 Students are engaged, participating, they ask good questions. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:10 PM EDT

@bivey you make a good point! I think people confuse effort with results. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:11 PM EDT

Q2. so on the other side, What does “lack of effort” look like? #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:11 PM EDT

I think it's one of those things you know when you see. Challenge is when it's outside of class. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:11 PM EDT

A1... and I'm proud as heck of her. But maybe someone with less talent put in more and equally focused time. Hard to know. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:12 PM EDT

a2 Often when person doesn't take care of things easily in their control. Sloppiness. #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:12 PM EDT

I love to see Ss who are eager to dive in and quench a thirst #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:13 PM EDT

@crottymark Right. And even beyond that, I've sweated bullets over crappy blogs and had beautiful ones fly off my fingers. #isedchat

ckoos1 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:13 PM EDT

A2: Head down, taking a long time to get a drink of water, not participating in a fun activity #isedchat

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:13 PM EDT

To separate a student’s “effort” from their performing the expected role of “good student” is a difficult task. #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:13 PM EDT

A2: complacency/accepting substandard performance/lack of pride #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:13 PM EDT

@bivey Yup.And I've gotten compliments on ones I thought were junk. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:14 PM EDT

Bit off focus, but so often the "effort" is merely being really good at doing school. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:15 PM EDT

A2 I think lack of focus (even if understandable) inevitably leads to lack of effort. There's the same effort/results connection. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:15 PM EDT

@crottymark Oy. Tell me about it! #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:15 PM EDT

@skeeTX yes, not taking advantage of opportunities to improve work or dig deeper. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:16 PM EDT

Q3. How can you tell if a student is having difficulty or just isn’t trying? #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:17 PM EDT

@mthayer_nj That is huge. I see many teachers who regularly conflate the two, often those who demand (rather than earn) respect. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:17 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 @skeeTX Isn't part of problem Scan go through all right motions and end up doing well? And is that effort we want? #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:18 PM EDT

A3. Some students are trying really hard but do not achieve good results. Could there be a learning problem...? #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:18 PM EDT

A3 Normally, I'd just have a conversation with the kid. They're pretty upfront if you've clearly there to support them. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:18 PM EDT

A3 If they seek help, ask questions, etc. #isedchat

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:18 PM EDT

@bivey Yes. And what does “good effort” mean for a kid for whom a topic comes easily? Conversely, “bad effort” if it’s difficult? #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:19 PM EDT

I have watched kids struggle to read... no matter how much effort... they just can't do it without a different approach. #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:19 PM EDT

A3: if you get to know your Ss, T can see if he/she is putting forth best effort. Relationships matter so T can be honest w/ S #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:20 PM EDT

@crottymark @lcarroll94 @skeeTX Ha! My first thought was, who gets to decide "right motions" and "doing well"?! #rebel #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:20 PM EDT

@crottymark @lcarroll94 Have to try and motivate Ss to want most out of themselves for their sake, not mine or Ps. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:20 PM EDT

Is a student who has ADD trying to focus on their work as best they can? #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:21 PM EDT

@mthayer_nj That's why I think you have to talk to kids and have them self-reflect. That quickly gets to what's really happening. #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:21 PM EDT

Analogous to football (soccer) as players must consistently put in a shift. Ss need similar discipline #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:21 PM EDT

@bivey @lcarroll94 @skeeTX Rhetorical question, yes? We know where the answer too often lies. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:22 PM EDT

@skeeTX @crottymark . Providing student authentic opportunities to learn and engage with material can motivate students. #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:22 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 Hard to say. Have to know the student and his/her habits/tendencies. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:22 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 And that's just one of the many factors that goes into ability to focus. Sleep. Interest in topic. A sick pet. #isedchat

LevelUpVillage Apr 7 @ 9:23 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 Often those same kids can do incredible work in the right #PBL-type environment w a topic of great interest. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:24 PM EDT

@crottymark @lcarroll94 @skeeTX The rhetoricalest of questions. & ideally, one answered for real in conversations (kid/me/class). #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:24 PM EDT

Also have to have realistic effort expectations depending on age of Ss. They tire, minds wander. Long school days! #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:24 PM EDT

@LevelUpVillage I completely agree with you. The right environment can inspire students to engage. #isedchat

LevelUpVillage Apr 7 @ 9:25 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 @skeeTX @crottymark Yes. That's why we connect kids for authentic global #STEAM learning #isedchat https://t.co/46EHj80hEd

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:25 PM EDT

@LevelUpVillage @bivey That’s a broader topic, and tied to effort. For many Ss, a “good effort” is what will earn a good grade. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:26 PM EDT

@LevelUpVillage @mthayer_nj Exactly. Which is part of why we don't use letter grades in our middle school. And I minimize rewards. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:26 PM EDT

@mthayer_nj @LevelUpVillage @bivey I have heard it said by Upper Schoolers before... is this "good enough" to get a good grade :( #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:26 PM EDT

@mthayer_nj @LevelUpVillage Yup. Those are the ones that struggle most (at first) with the inward refocusing our school demands. #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:26 PM EDT

@mthayer_nj @LevelUpVillage @bivey Sad but true. Do just enough. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:27 PM EDT

@mthayer_nj @LevelUpVillage For many Ts as well, yes? #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:27 PM EDT

@bivey @LevelUpVillage @mthayer_nj And why I love working in the Lower School.. learning for learning's sake. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:27 PM EDT

Q4. Do you think students know/understand what good “effort” is? At what age/ grade? #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:27 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 @mthayer_nj @LevelUpVillage Oy. Yes. I always turn that back on the kid. Where is it strong? could it be improved? #isedchat

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:28 PM EDT

If we’ve decided what we want Ss to learn, their natural response is to be very practical: this is what I must do to achieve X. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:28 PM EDT

A4 Think they know pretty early on, even if they can't really articulate it. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:29 PM EDT

A4 I feel like the seventh graders have a pretty good sense; they are so honest in self-reflection about their effort. #isedchat

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:29 PM EDT

@crottymark @LevelUpVillage Absolutely. If you have a behaviorist view of education, with carrots & sticks, “effort” matters. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:29 PM EDT

A4 One reason I love athletics for kids--amount of effort is pretty clear and they learn what it really means. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:29 PM EDT

@mthayer_nj That's why I turn all content decisions over to kids. Starting to wonder if I should co-design structure w/them too. #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:30 PM EDT

A4: many Ss think in terms of results to make a grade=please Ps, get into high school/college. #isedchat

theatlis Apr 7 @ 9:30 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 They need to learn it. Ss sometimes struggle to differentiate between "I really want to do well" & "I worked hard" #isedchat

LevelUpVillage Apr 7 @ 9:30 PM EDT

@crottymark @mthayer_nj Interesting thought. Are teacher evals the same as what kids experience w grades? Effort vs. results? #isedchat

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:30 PM EDT

@bivey Ah, to be able to do that…as a math T, the content in upper school is pretty much determined. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:31 PM EDT

@mthayer_nj @LevelUpVillage True, but I'm also thinking how many Ts just assume kid isn't trying if can't get something. #isedchat

theatlis Apr 7 @ 9:31 PM EDT

@bivey I think that goes back to the relationship Ts have with Ss. That honesty comes after the relationship is built. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:31 PM EDT

Is effort something that should be modeled? Can it be taught? #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:31 PM EDT

@crottymark Just coached 2nd grade soccer match tonight. Spot on! Some still care most a/b winning, even Ps. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:31 PM EDT

@crottymark The performing arts are much the same - individual effort contributing to the group's goals and outcomes. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:32 PM EDT

@LevelUpVillage @mthayer_nj In a poorly designed system, for sure. #isedchat

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:32 PM EDT

@crottymark @LevelUpVillage There’s that piece of it also, for sure. All of these issues are all bound up together… #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:32 PM EDT

@theatlis Very much. Granting that some kids (and teachers) quickly and hopefully extend trust while others hold back initially. #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:32 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 yes, we Ts should effort w/ Ss, not just assign and watch. Mentors can show firsthand. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:32 PM EDT

@bivey Definitely. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:33 PM EDT

@mthayer_nj I know. For now. ;-) #isedchat

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:33 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 Only if we also teach Ss how to decide what things are important. Not everything in life is worthy of major effort. #isedchat

theatlis Apr 7 @ 9:34 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 Yes &Yes. Even if results poor I run, don't get faster, keep plugging b/c good for me & sense of pride in finishing. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:35 PM EDT

@mthayer_nj @lcarroll94 True...but few things should get a slipshod effort either. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:35 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 Well, if we're not modeling effort, than something's wrong, no? "Can it be taught" is tougher - maybe ignited? #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:36 PM EDT

@bivey @lcarroll94 Think it can be contagious! #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:37 PM EDT

@bivey A lot of responsive classroom approach is teaching skills explicitly and deliberately. #Isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:37 PM EDT

@crottymark @mthayer_nj @lcarroll94 Are we talking prioritization more than effort? Relates to workload. A whole nother question. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:38 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 @bivey Yes, but is effort really a skill? Seems more the willingness to use them, do them well. #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:38 PM EDT

Hi. Joining late. Marcy, from CT. #isedchat Good evening, everyone. :)

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:38 PM EDT

Q5. Do you believe student effort be measured and graded? If so, how? Should it be included on report card? #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:39 PM EDT

A4: Some do. Many do not. I teach Spanish. Students who don't even respond to simple ? accurately don't know what good effort is. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:39 PM EDT

@bivey @mthayer_nj @lcarroll94 Perhaps. My point is, whatever one does should be done with some effort. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:39 PM EDT

@crottymark @lcarroll94 We use to assess effort in our middle school, but decided it was too subjective and hard to tease out. #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:40 PM EDT

Hi, @bivey :) #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:40 PM EDT

@crottymark @mthayer_nj @lcarroll94 Ah. I see now. Yes, there I completely agree. :-) #isedchat

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:40 PM EDT

@teachermrw Good to see you Marcy! :) #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:40 PM EDT

A5: Ts can applaud effort in comments, not a believer to grade effort alone. Heck, not sure about grades in general #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:41 PM EDT

A5: It can, but only in a very subjective manner. Teachers take into account what great or poor effort is, depending on student. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:41 PM EDT

@bivey @lcarroll94 Assess as in giving a grade? Or just commenting on? #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:41 PM EDT

@teachermrw Hi! How are you tonight? I'm tired (up early to drive 8th graders to the train station) but happy. #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:41 PM EDT

@mthayer_nj Hi, Mike! You, too. :) #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:41 PM EDT

@bivey @crottymark @lcarroll94 Did you then transition to your comments/standards? #isedchat

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:41 PM EDT

@crottymark @bivey @lcarroll94 I think as teachers we demand Ss give their “best effort” to everything. That’s a mistake. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:42 PM EDT

@mthayer_nj Agreed! We often fail to consider the total impact of the demands on kids. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:42 PM EDT

@crottymark @lcarroll94 We used to use a 1-3 scale (when we still had letter grades). But these days... #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:43 PM EDT

@mthayer_nj @crottymark @bivey @lcarroll94 Ts have to be realistic. Are Ts efforting 100% of the time? #isedchat

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:43 PM EDT

A5 I feel about grading effort the same way I do about grading for participation. I honestly don’t see how it can be done fairly. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:43 PM EDT

@crottymark @bivey We had it on our report cards for lower grades (1 - 4). We have since removed it... we now comment on it. #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:43 PM EDT

@bivey I'm okay. Dealing with personal matters. Tired, too. :( #isedchat Have a safe trip. :)

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:44 PM EDT

@crottymark @lcarroll94 ... few of us even comment on effort. Try to describe skills/results as objectively as possible #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:44 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 @crottymark @bivey Did Ps react to just receiving comments? Ts see as more work? #isedchat

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:44 PM EDT

@crottymark That’s what I was getting at - I think we can’t ask Ss to treat everything they do w/= value & worthy of = effort. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:45 PM EDT

@skeeTX @crottymark @lcarroll94 We did. And starting to evolve toward just using narrative comments, I suspect. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:45 PM EDT

@bivey @crottymark I agree with that. It's so subjective. You can comment on results and growth. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:45 PM EDT

@mthayer_nj There we agree. I guess what I'm saying is the effort may vary, but hope there always is some effort and care. #isedchat

ConsultJodi Apr 7 @ 9:45 PM EDT

@skeeTX @bivey @crottymark @lcarroll94 You can either work hard, or smart. How do you measure each? #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:46 PM EDT

@teachermrw Sorry to hear it. I was just dropping the kids/chaperones off, but I do hear the trip is going well. :-) #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:46 PM EDT

@bivey @skeeTX @crottymark @lcarroll94 Narrative comments are a bear! Did them for six years at previous school. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:46 PM EDT

@ConsultJodi @skeeTX @crottymark @lcarroll94 Or both. But I make no attempt to measure either. #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:46 PM EDT

@bivey @skeeTX @crottymark @lcarroll94 My previous school issued no grades. Therefore, the narratives were long and comprehensive. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:46 PM EDT

@teachermrw @bivey @skeeTX @crottymark But they do show how well we know our students. I enjoy reading them for the Lower School. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:46 PM EDT

Recall some Ts not wanting to give incredible S writer award because thought it was easy for him. I knew how much drafting hedid. #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:47 PM EDT

@ConsultJodi @bivey @crottymark @lcarroll94 Measuring is the key issue. Subjective based on only 1 Ts perspective. #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:47 PM EDT

@teachermrw @skeeTX @crottymark @lcarroll94 They take way longer, agreed. And I also believe they are way more productive. #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:47 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 @bivey @skeeTX @crottymark Absolutely. I agree. #isedchat Teachers weren't allowed much time to write them.

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:48 PM EDT

@teachermrw @lcarroll94 @skeeTX @crottymark That's the tricky part. Our midterms are a bit of a squeeze; end-of-term less so. #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:49 PM EDT

@bivey @skeeTX @crottymark @lcarroll94 Absolutely. As long as teachers are given ample time. 1 report took me 30 minutes to write. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:49 PM EDT

What are specific ways teachers can inspire students to put forth more effort? #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:50 PM EDT

@teachermrw @skeeTX @crottymark @lcarroll94 Yup. I average about 15-20 minutes/report, but it can spike to 30+, for sure. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:50 PM EDT

I think that providing engaging and authentic learning experiences definitely has an effect on effort. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:51 PM EDT

More autonomy within work worth their doing. More open-endedness and relevance. #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:51 PM EDT

Ts can have dialogue w/ Ss about Ss own goals. Hear their whys and discuss. Conversations still allow Ss to learn, esp a/b self #isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:51 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 I think when kids have agency in course content, activities, and assessment, effort tends to come naturally. #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:51 PM EDT

A6: Model what good work looks like. Require re-dos when work is sub-par. Reinforce effort, and it's relationship to mastery. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:51 PM EDT

providing opportunities for students to "iterate." If they know that they can re-do something to make it better, they work harder. #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:51 PM EDT

@lcarroll94 like worksheets!!! 😜 #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:52 PM EDT

@skeeTX JUST SAY NO TO WORKSHEETS!!! #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:52 PM EDT

When there is a audience, effort often rises. #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:52 PM EDT

Ts should also ask for Ss feedback to better serve them. #isedchat

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:52 PM EDT

@bivey @lcarroll94 That’s the key right there. If we are looking for effort we need to give Ss a real reason to want to exert it. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:52 PM EDT

@crottymark Agreed! and an authentic audience is even more inspiring. If you are building something, invite architects...#isedchat

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:53 PM EDT

@crottymark Oy. I mentored a kid who did a Senior Project in sound engineering. Evaluators had no clue how time-consuming it was. #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:53 PM EDT

@teachermrw Will requiring more work produce desired outcome long term? #isedchat

IndyCurriculum Apr 7 @ 9:55 PM EDT

Next week's ICG webinars: Shadowing Students 4/12 https://t.co/PTNsB7sifF & Minerva U (FREE!) 4/13 https://t.co/8mQJQAPjXi #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:55 PM EDT

@skeeTX Not more work, but demanding that a student attain at least minimum expectations. Some don't do that much. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:55 PM EDT

In some cases, the older students get, the less authentic the learning becomes because of the focus on grades/output. #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:55 PM EDT

Part of challenge is that we're having a conversation about how important effort is, but we end up "rewarding" other things. #isedchat

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:55 PM EDT

@teachermrw And if they choose to do less, won't consequences motivate as well? #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:55 PM EDT

@skeeTX On the other hand, people who are masters of a skill devoted many hours to the task. #isedchat So, in a word: effort.

skeeTX Apr 7 @ 9:56 PM EDT

@teachermrw Then they're rewarded. #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:56 PM EDT

@skeeTX For many, it does. #isedchat Esp. if grades are attached.

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:56 PM EDT

@crottymark EXACTLY. Grades, SATs, APs, GPA... all of it. :( #isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:57 PM EDT

@teachermrw @skeeTX Not just effort, but very focused and intentional effort. #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:57 PM EDT

@skeeTX Yes. Most of us work towards some sort of reward, no? #isedchat

teachermrw Apr 7 @ 9:58 PM EDT

@crottymark @skeeTX Yes. I am thinking of a prima ballerina, or a top violinist, or, a Lebron James. #isedchat

lcarroll94 - Moderator Apr 7 @ 9:58 PM EDT

Thanks to everyone for joining us tonight for a great discussion on effort! #isedchat is always a highlight of my week :)

bivey Apr 7 @ 9:58 PM EDT

@crottymark Can we reframe effort as a necessary means to a given end, the achievement of which becomes the reward????? #isedchat

mthayer_nj Apr 7 @ 9:59 PM EDT

@crottymark I was thinking about this in a different context - one hears how important it is for Ss to become “risk-takers”, but…#isedchat

crottymark Apr 7 @ 9:59 PM EDT

@bivey Like that. But as I just tweet and you like--internal or external reward? #isedchat