Each Monday evening at 8PM EST, music teachers get together and share ideas about important topics within music education. It’s a great chance to interact directly with educators from all over the world and to get new tips and tricks to help you succeed in the classroom. The entire #musedchat discussion is organized and moderated by Joe Guarr.
Thank you for using it for the chat. I've often wondered why students have a hard time transferring music skills from one situation to another. Either piece to piece or from classroom music to ensemble rehearsal. #musedchat
Q1: When students move from an elementary general setting to a secondary music class, what skills do they seem to have the most difficulty transferring? #musedchat
A1 I’m a level removed, but I feel like transferring pitch reading to an instrument after elementary general music was a challenge in my previous job #musedchat
A1: my experience is with kids moving from General Music in 6th grade to Choral ensemble in 7th. They don't seem to easily apply music literacy skills in this new setting. Also instrumentalists don't apply their skills to reading music in Chorus. #musedchat
A1 I’m a level removed, but I feel like transferring pitch reading to an instrument after elementary general music was a challenge in my previous job #musedchat
Since our whole K-12 system has transferred to pitch reading using solfege and rhythm reading using takadimi, most of the rhythm problems have gone away unless they are newly introduced rhythms #musedchat
It always feels like 100% a rhythm issue (b/c the pulse goes bye-bye) but its probably more that the kids are stopping time to decipher and decode. #musedchat
Beth Gen/choral 2-5
A1 I find that students are hesitant to view themselves as musicians and discount the knowledge they’ve gained in elem gen. #musedchat
Loved digging into your podcast the last few days. We are deeply embedded in the PLC culture, but as a 6-12 instrumental team. I’m anxiously awaiting your posts/casts on using literacy as a common piece between B/O/C #musedchat
A1: I see a huge decline in creativity or willingness to really take risks and make mistakes- a middle school thing seen in all areas in sure but glaringly obvious in Music! #musedchat
That's very interesting - I've often wondered if part of the problem is a difference is vocabulary or phrasing. I'm not using the exact same words so the students are not accessing prior knowledge #musedchat
It is interesting because we are finding that kids nail takadimi, but unless we have them say pitch/solfege in rhythm they struggle in sight reading. Anyone else? #musedchat our Ss tend to focus on pitch accuracy as a default in the moment not rhythm
Hmmm, my guess is our students are the opposite. They can nail the rhythm but struggle with the finger combinations necessary to perform the pitches. #musedchat
A2: I try to put a lot of focus on having my kids do longtones to focus on all the good sound and control stuff, but then they just go back to huff&puff as soon as they try to read. #musedchat
A2 breathing for choir. I have struggled to get students use their breath efficiently. I recently got my Pilates certification and have begun using posture and breathing techniques with students. #musedchat
a2: Pattern recognition. We do a few scales as part of the warmup routine, but if a scalar 16th note run appears in our concert music, some kids just freeze #musedchat
A2: Bowings! It’s as if they don’t exist unless I remind them- particularly bad when sight reading. Students also have trouble telling the difference between ties and slurs and how that effects bow work #musedchat
A2b: also, String players think they don’t need to breathe!!! I wish we could transfer that from general/ choir more easily- always reminding my kids to breathe and often warm up with breathing exercises #musedchat
A2: is compound meter not covered in methods because publishers say it’s too hard? It gets covers in takadimi early but hard to reinforce in literature #MusEdChat
have you ever tried "NOW WE WILL IMMEDIATELY APPLY THIS BREATHING WARM UP AND EXERCISE INTO A REPERTOIRE SITUATION TO DERIVE THE DESIRED EFFECT"? #musedchat
Ooh, I really like that idea. Lately I've been trying to cherry pick tough rhythms and incorporate them into warmups, this will be even better #musedchat
Same with percussionists. I can't tell you how many times I've said "Come on, you have to breathe to live. Just do it at the same time as everybody else." #musedchat
is compound meter when the beat is written as subdvided into three instead of two in this situation? I feel like every time someone brings it up it changes on me. #musedchat
A2: is compound meter not covered in methods because publishers say it’s too hard? It gets covers in takadimi early but hard to reinforce in literature #MusEdChat
Try having them play a 12-count long tone (for example) then choose a section of music that requires the same paced air (might be 4-5 measures of a fast piece) ask them to make breath feel the same #MusEdChat
A2: I try to put a lot of focus on having my kids do longtones to focus on all the good sound and control stuff, but then they just go back to huff&puff as soon as they try to read. #musedchat
A2: is compound meter not covered in methods because publishers say it’s too hard? It gets covers in takadimi early but hard to reinforce in literature #MusEdChat
Yes! We need to get them to understand what it FEELS like to do these concepts. What does it feel like to phrase that way? Play in that tonal center? Play that rhythm at that tempo? #musedchat
Playing playing playing! Recording also opens up their eyes but more importantly their ears. Unlike math or art unless. They record what they are playing they can't reflect/improve effectively #musedchat
A3: choose one fundamental as your rehearsal “through-thread” so you connect it in all aspects of playing. Before long all fundamental concepts are connected #MusEdChat
A3 I try to draw connections beyond music. Often some can begin to create new connections I hadn't considered. There is a lot of time to correct bad connections and "crossed wires" #musedchat
Hard to quantify in 280 characters. Lots of repetition and consistency. Warm up in that tonal center. Use rhythms, articulations, and pitch patterns from the piece. What does it feel like? #musedchat
A3 Playing playing playing! Recording also opens up their eyes but more importantly their ears. If they don't record what they are playing they can't reflect/improve effectively
#musedchat
A3 Layers. Say the rhythm. Say it with fingers. “Sizzle it” with fingers. Play it on a single pitch. Play it like it’s written. What do each of those things feel like? #musedchat
And since man is vain, how many recording attempts did they make before sending that one? If they tried fifteen times, then they just practiced one little thing for about three minutes! #musedchat
A3.2 we call them fundamentals as “warm-up” seems to make kids think it is something you do before learning and fundamentals, in all sports, suggest a necessary part of “winning” #MusEdChat
I would then add articulations to the 12cts. Tongue half notes, then quarters, then 8ths. Articulations make it more difficult to preserve and manage air. #musedchat
To add another layer, I talk about breath management relating to dynamics much like percussionists use level heights. 16-ct air = piano volume. So… play that quietly = make that section feel like 16 ct breath management #musedchat
I would then add articulations to the 12cts. Tongue half notes, then quarters, then 8ths. Articulations make it more difficult to preserve and manage air. #musedchat
So many have no desire to even attempt to practice, but they all of a sudden can do it with the best of them when they want to make a recording! #musedchat
Sometimes that is the problem - what do you call alphabetical name? Note or pitch? What do you call rhythmic value? Note or …? We don’t get time to align this so there is much unintentional confusion #MusEdChat
