Welcome to #TeachWriting our (monthly) chat about writing instruction! It's been a while - welcome back! Our topic is ARGUMENT WRITING, and our moderator is co-founder @bkuhl2you. Please introduce yourself and tell us how you've been doing!
Welcome everyone! Phew - it's been a while! I'm Ben, a 6th grade science and reading/writing teacher at a public middle school in the Chicago suburbs. I've been leading this chat for almost 4 years? I think? #TeachWriting
#TeachWriting is a traditional chat - questions will come from this account, and will start with Q1, Q2, etc. Please respond with A1, A2, etc. Please also be sure to include the hashtag (#TeachWriting) in your response! We'll start the questions in just a moment!
We have some tough questions tonight - hope you brought your thinking caps! Feel free to jump in, even if you don't think you're an expert - we value your thoughts - we're all here to learn! Be sure to stick around for the resource share and the archive! #TeachWriting
Q1 - How important is it to explicitly teach argument over other modes or genres? Is it one among many equals, or is it a high priority? Why? #TeachWriting
Thanks for being here, Scott! (Yes, we're locked in a hell called a polar vortex - two days off school, but we're scared to go outside tomorrow . . . ) #TeachWriting
A1: formulating an argument in written form is necessary if we want our Ss to be convincing writers. That being said, let’s make sure they’re writing about something that inspires them, not just a formula #TeachWriting
A1- I believe argument writing is a high priority considering students need to know how to make compelling arguments using supporting text evidence. #TeachWriting
A1 - I think it's a really useful genre. I think the fact that it's an important standard in most states and districts doesn't hurt. When you position it well, it's something kids can enjoy (as long as they haven't been too traumatized by previous instruction). #TeachWriting
A1) I think teaching argument is the most important form of writing we can teach students. Teaching them to identify the counterclaims specifically. Acknowledging other perspectives is missing in modern discourse #TeachWriting
A1. I resist the urge to prioritize discourses, but bc narrative & research can be used in service of argument, it’s powerful, & it’s essential for democratic life. #teachwriting
A1 Olson, Scarcella & Matuchniak make a strong claim for teaching narrative writing first.
https://t.co/ErItq8zxRb IMHO, social studies Ts overdo argumentative writing b/c it is emphasized in AP as a marker of college-readiness. We need to teach all 3 text types. #TeachWriting
A1: It is one of several rhetorical modes, all of which serve as a toolkit for writing. Choice of mode will vary with the intent of the piece and the audience for which it is intended. #teachwriting
A1-I teach 1st grade and we are just beginning to teach argumentative writing/opinion writing. It is so important for students to have that exposure at a young age #TeachWriting
Q2 - Where do you find authentic models to share with students? What are some examples of models of argument you share (or would like to)? #TeachWriting
A1: the art of written (and oral) argument is a big learning curve for teens who might feel a bit more comfortable with persuasive writing (and speaking). #TeachWriting
Agree - it's an important part of reading and understanding how people argue and persuade - and how we might respond, disagree, and/or think about what they are trying to say to us. #TeachWriting
A1b: Ss benefit if their assignments have meaningful outcomes. Writing to convince a T or admin for privileges, or asking for school policies to be reviewed. They need to be invested #TeachWriting
Q2 - Where do you find authentic models to share with students? What are some examples of models of argument you share (or would like to)? #TeachWriting
A1. Pretty important. When we teach arguments, we’re preparing students to join academic conversations—and that might involve writing in lots of different genres. #TeachWriting
Angela sliding in late because I was using the wrong hashtag. Gah! A1--I feel it is of highest priority because writers who know how to use their words to advocate for themselves and others are empowered to seek and protect equity in our world. #TeachWriting
A1. What’s important is that we help students be knowledge producers, not just knowledge consumers. And knowledge is produced, shared, challenged, and changed through arguments. #TeachWriting
A2. I provide a variety of genres in argumentative discourse. McSweeney’s Internet Tendency for satire. The Atlantic for photo essays & extended arguments. Childish Gambino’s “This is America” for music video. The Ringer for analytic arguments. So many poets too! #teachwriting
We do a lot of real world examples such as convincing parents to let us go to bed later or requesting longer recess from our principal. Connecting their writing to personal experience is crucial #TeachWriting
#Teachwriting Validation is actually now a part of our unit. This skill has become more important than ever in a world influenced by the ridiculousness of social media platforms where Ss think all information is authentic.
I've done this, too - we wrote arguments about a school rule we wanted to change, and we did surveys of classmates or teachers to try to find supporting evidence. Best stuff was about chewing gum - teacher survey showed some Ts agreed. #TeachWriting
A2. Published student models are great. A colleague told me about the Grassroots Writing Research Journal at Illinois State U: https://t.co/9tWv4yULhn#TeachWriting
A2 - I shared a couple of mentor text resources before the chat - NCTE had a blog post about mentor texts, and there were a couple of sites with sample student work. There's also the Common Core anchor papers - at https://t.co/Cbz0vLoqoe, I think . . . #TeachWriting
A2) I've seen some fun ones. Band T in reference to the "scatter band" by Stanford asks when is it ok to break tradition. Graphic design
T teaching copyright asking if whether or not an artist work belongs to them or the public #h&M T #relevance#TeachWriting
A2 - I think it helps when you have models from previous years. That's one of the coolest resources you can create for yourself - a bunch of student essays that you can share when appropriate, anonymously or not, and talk about the process and thinking. #TeachWriting
A3: if we want our Ss to grow up and converse in a civil manner, we need to address pertinent topics that are real in Ss lives. Writing can be a bridge that may shrink the gap between opposing viewpoints. We need good writers and better listeners! #TeachWriting
A3. We do some groundwork to ensure what they what they want to argue can account for divergent perspectives. That process weeds out anything too unfounded to stand. #teachwriting
A3: No. And this is scary hard. I honestly believe that schools should be places where we can help kids process and talk about the tough stuff. I do help them assess the quality of their arguments and if they serve others well, though. #Teachwriting
Q3 Great question. Listening. I think the more provocative the better but we have to be careful. It's important that we don't craft prompts that are one-sided. #TeachWriting
A3-Typically I allow my students to choose their topics. Most 1st graders choose topics that relate to their family/school life or their local community. I would hate to steer them away from a topic that they are passionate about though! #TeachWriting
A3 - Short answer - I try not to. I worry that taking away a kid's choice, even if it's not the most comfortable thing in the world, can hurt that kid as a writer. I've done it a few times when it was too crass or inappropriate for the age (middle school), but #TeachWriting
I also like to ask Qs like, "Why are you the person to make this argument? Who's the audience?" A lot of times they just want to write to ppl who agree with them, or write about topics where they don't have the authority to do so. #teachwriting
A3: Depends on the school environment& support of admin. I'm at a private school that steers clear of political content that may polarize families. We explain the value of opinions, but Ss frequently simply repeat what they hear at home, not their own thoughts. #teachwriting
A2. I created a #Fortnite prompt for my son and his friends (5th grade). They can't get enough of it. My son asks me to write essays for fun because many of the prompts interest him. We are seeing the same in classrooms. #highengagement#TeachWriting
A3 (cont) I think it's always been a bad thing when I do that. It's a tough thing - sometimes kids want to pick a bad topic so that they can blame you when they don't want to do the work. Other times, they really care deeply and want a chance to explore it. #TeachWriting
A4. Most Ss come in with a pre-formed opinion. After some brain dumps of why they think what they do, which exposes any assumed evidence, we read more on their topics, especially from opposing or alternate viewpoints to ensure a solid evidence base. #teachwriting
A4 We agreed to use the C-E-R strategies across all disciplines, science, ELA & History. This helps Ss do better w pre-writing b/c they are familiar with the format.
https://t.co/r6sMVHjJwG Hard to get Ts to agree on using similar strats. #TeachWriting
A4: Evidence. Always. We research topics and use a variety of approaches to verify sources. Then, evidence gathering. Then, claim. Otherwise, we run the risk of perpetuating confirmation bias. #TeachWriting
That's a pretty cool idea. One of my favorite narratives from this year was an incredibly vivid and detailed account of a Fortnite game. If it's what they know, and what they want to write about (and it's not too violent), then cool. #TeachWriting
It's great. Tons of resources that use classic and modern literature for lessons. Each unit is packed with more resources than you could possibly use in a year. Full novel studies, writing projects, the works. #TeachWriting
In reply to
@timlriley, @TeachWriting2, @studysync
A3. I like to start by asking what’s at issue for a particular community. If a question isn’t at issue, I might steer students away from it--or at least encourage them to think about how they raise the issue. #TeachWriting
A4 Really great Q!! They have to have some knowledge of the topic to write a thesis, then can expand support with add'l research, so some evidence (basic) before thesis. #teachwriting
A4: too often Ss look to the T and a provided formula/map/rubric to make a grade instead of diving in and figuring out their own direction. #TeachWriting
So Q4 is kind of a weird- I was thinking about how kids seek out evidence when they already have a claim, and then they can't find any, so what do they do? They pick bad evidence? Or change the claim? I know that most of the time, as a kid, I picked bad evidence. #TeachWriting
A3. Sometimes students want to revisit issues that are no longer debatable in academic settings (e.g., whether or not we can be “colorblind”). In those cases, I ask, “What have others already said about this? Is there agreement? What’s timely and important now?” #TeachWriting
Maybe I'm wrong. It seems like a lot of our students don't have a lot of background. Maybe they need a good learning opportunity to develop it. #TeachWriting
Q4 I think engaging them it what I call a 'hook' is first. I use a 4 part prompt Hook, Thesis/Premise, Map, and Assertion. If the hook doesn't connect to the students interest, we can lose them. Ex. compelling quote, statistics, artwork, song, text, etc. #TeachWriting
I have a hard time lately with how forced writing can be at times in school. How many adults can be told to sit down at a specific time and produce fine writing on the spot? Yet, aren’t our Ss expected to do just that? #TeachWriting
A4. For me, listening, paraphrase, summary, and synthesis come first—then more evidence gathering and analysis. Writers are ready to start developing a position once they have a sense of the conversation and what they can contribute. #TeachWriting
Jumping in a little late but Ashleigh Rose here from DC - I teach 7th and 8th Grade Writing and we’re in the middle of Argument right now! #TeachWriting
Yes - on-demand writing is a frustration, and I'm sure we've talked about this a few times. In the real world, adults invest time in important writing. But schools - and especially standardized tests - expect that kids can sit and write. #TeachWriting
Q4) cont. I have Ss go the the side of the room that aligns with their argument, pair up and generate evidence. Then I invite examples from each side. One side becomes their claim, the other their counterclaim. Ss will switch sides in the middle of the activity. #TeachWriting
A5. This one is so hard because research is inefficient. You have to be willing to be a big spender. The more data points you collect, the more connections you can make. #TeachWriting
We know that effective writing instruction helps kids with on-demand writing tasks. We also hope that some day, the world will accept that standardized tests are not worth the time, money, and stress . . . #TeachWriting
It helps when they have to do one in Science, then one in math, one in English. We try to space them out, but we want Ss to do at least 1 per month. #teachwriting
A5. I try to teach argument as inquiry, so listening to the convo, annotating texts, quick-writes, pair-shares—that’s all part of evidence collection. #TeachWriting
#teachwriting I do this as a crowd-sourced exercise. Each Ss is assigned an article relevant to the overall topic (not all Ss pick the same thesis, but the main area of research is the same), which they then summarize for all in a shared doc. Ss can then go look for the evidence
A5. 1/2 I teach smash & grab: Brainstorm keywords. Use 1 & enter into search engine. Open tabs to any titles that seem relevant. Review open tabs for source credibility (close out bad ones). Skim headings for relevance (close out bad ones). #teachwriting
A5. 2/2 Read what remains. Brain dump after each article to start getting the research in your own words. Can use *** in place of numbers, etc. Save links. We use Easy Bib or Noodle Tools for citations, but I show them how to review for corrections. #teachwriting
We started with brain storm, then search, then annotated bibliographies, organize, insert signal phrases, follow AEC/RACE/ICE ... conference #TeachWriting
A5. And MLA 8 is gold. It’s all about understanding and engaging the discourse community. And citing sources rhetorically. There’s more than one right way to cite a source now. Depends on what your audience needs. https://t.co/zdCQTEPEHB#TeachWriting
Would love to hear ways you teach validation. We don’t have media studies/librarians and have short classes so often I give my students the research and hesitate when they want to go find more of their own bc: quality control. But you’re right - it’s crucial. #teachwriting
#Teachwriting Validation is actually now a part of our unit. This skill has become more important than ever in a world influenced by the ridiculousness of social media platforms where Ss think all information is authentic.
I use your Loop Writing strategy in my History classes several times per year. It is a brilliant way to get Ss to keep pushing their pens. https://t.co/nY8q1GZncJ#TeachWriting
A5 - This is a hard question! I'm not sure that I have a good answer. I usually model with simple texts and simple claims - ask the kids to think about evidence in a picture book, with a claim like "Billy isn't nice." #TeachWriting
That’s my point though...the arbitrary nature of school and how we decide what to do, when, assign a grade and repeat. Seems flawed and has to be a better way to interest Ss, tap into their passions and spark creativity #teachwriting
. . . and the research itself can become its own rabbit hole. I've been caught in many of these, personally. The best research, though, is open-ended, and includes time spent following dead ends that are useless but instructive. #TeachWriting
The CER quick-writes have been game changers for our Ts writing across the curriculum. Ss are writing more, sometimes daily, and the simple rubric makes it easy for teachers to provide feedback. Some Ts assign one a day and let student share with peers and pick one to submit.
Q6 - What about STRUCTURE? Five paragraphs or not, outlines and specific requirements for use of evidence - do you require writers to use a specific structure? If so, what? Why? #TeachWriting
Pretty cool - I've often found that kids know very little about search strategies like limiters (using + and - in google, for example). Teaching that makes them a lot more efficient at research. #TeachWriting
A6: I have to use structure because of the tie in with History. The History argumentative essays are so planned out, I would confuse my students if I changed the format. #TeachWriting
A6. Because genre is variable when I teach argument, structure is variable too. Conference convos center on inductive or deductive structure. #teachwriting
A6 I care about content not length. If you can demonstrate mastery of the skill ina paragraph, it better be the best damn paragraph. Writing is about communicating well, not about length #TeachWriting
A6: anything to avoid redundancy!!!! No need to kind of tell me your point, say it several times and hit me over the head with it again!!!! Identify and support your point. Keep it simple #TeachWriting
A6: I am steering away from forced structure this year in favor of stronger writing/voice. Thesis will be highly structured, but I am not requiring 5 paragraphs if a 3 paragraph piece is excellent. #teachwriting
A6 I try to trick Ss into writing longer form essays. They get their main ideas down in quickwrites, then weave them together after a few weeks or a month. Last year I got 15 pp on Battlefield Medicine spanning 3 wars. #TeachWriting
I'm using the Writing Units of Study right now, 6th grade literary analysis, and guess what we're teaching? The 5-paragraph essay! Mixed feelings about it. #TeachWriting
#TeachWriting I try. My attempt is to get mine to preprinted through our entire romeo and juleit unit then argue for or against shakespeare in the curriculum
A6 When I taught 9th graders I used MEAL and RAFT paragraphs to coach them on structure. https://t.co/4Ng86GUNAs With 11th & 12th graders they need to master MLA Headings. #TeachWriting
A6- I teach 7th with most EL Ss. They need the structure of 5 paragraphs. For scaffolding, I use an outline of claim, support, opposing view, counterclaim, and conclusion. #TeachWriting
My only request is for grade school teachers to please stop teaching “I think this” or “I know this because” as part of an essay. Have to spend the all of high school breaking them of it #TeachWriting
Q7 - What are some ways that you encourage your writers to be creative with argument - i.e. use narrative, make some other product type, etc.? #TeachWriting
A6 - I'm glad no one said "outlines." I have nightmares about required outlines in 12th grade English. I think the argument needs to be organized - it needs some kind of structure - but I want the structure to fit the purpose of the argument. Hard, but yeah. #TeachWriting
Wonder how persuasive/effective Ss can be if writing a lengthy text message as opposed to an essay. Might be good place to start the process..... #TeachWriting
We communicate that way but Ss are then expected to become more formal, which is foreign to their nature. Then add social media, texting etc....I see why Ss struggle writing at times. #teachwriting
Love the focus on voice - 5 paragraph essay does become such a rush for so many kids that only the fastest processors ever get to really add voice in in shorter timelined units. #teachwriting
#teachwriting We actually do this as part of literary analysis. Might be harder for younger Ss, but worth considering! We also create a Twitter convo for characterization. (Tweet as the character)
BONUS QUESTION: What tools, programs, or whatever do you find indispensable - or at least really helpful - when you teach argument? Links are helpful! #TeachWriting
A6. I think the transfer value is in helping students learn how to make decisions about structure. Figuring out genre features, audience expectations, discourse conventions—that’s all high-level, but super important, work. Students need practice making choices. #TeachWriting
A7 - I want to do more with visual literacy and argument. I'm hoping someone has a brilliant idea with pictures. Wordless argument? Comics? Google Image argument - ten pictures that make a case? #TeachWriting
A6. I also see this as a place where students really struggle and need extra support and encouragement. Organizing our ideas effectively is a challenge for all writers. Productive struggle leads to growth and independence. #TeachWriting
A6 Depends on where the Ss are & what our goals are. We have found that structure can eliminate the blank page syndrome freeing Ss up to communicate their ideas. Once they internalize the elements of an argument, we remove the structures. #scaffolding#TeachWriting
A6. Too much scaffolding interferes with rhetorical problem solving. Students don’t get better at making choices about structure if all the choices are always made for them. #TeachWriting
Not trying to be a pessimist tonight. Spend much of my day observing Ss & classes and just wonder how the experience of school could and should improve. Ss voice and choice seems to be obvious yet how much do they have on a daily basis, even when writing? #TeachWriting
A7. I love @Tom_Newkirk’s _Minds Made for Stories_. Narratives make arguments, and arguments can have a dramatic arc. Poetry, fiction, images—I’m pretty much in the “everything’s an argument” camp. #TeachWriting
A7 - I want to do more with visual literacy and argument. I'm hoping someone has a brilliant idea with pictures. Wordless argument? Comics? Google Image argument - ten pictures that make a case? #TeachWriting
I use picture books. We discuss reasons vs whining (earrings by Judith viorst), different methods with click clack moo, perspective with true story of 3 little pigs, and bad arguments with don’t let the pigeon drive the bus #TeachWriting
Bonus Q: #teachwriting this may be cliché but I’ve found @procon_org a fantastic tool to help Ss find their voice in an argument. Also, pop up debates have helped me help those are are reluctant to voice their arguments aloud to flush them out.
BONUS QUESTION: What tools, programs, or whatever do you find indispensable - or at least really helpful - when you teach argument? Links are helpful! #TeachWriting
Bonus - I've mentioned them before, but CRIME AND PUZZLEMENT is a series of books with pictures that kids try to use to solve a crime. It's supposed to teach using evidence for argument. When I search "crime scene puzzles," though, there are lots of other options. #TeachWriting
I get that, but when real world/businesses/marketing ignores rules of English and writing, what do we tell Ss about why they need to do formal/traditional writing? Or if blogs/podcasts are more powerful to them? #teachwriting
Great book - I've been working on that, too - presenting something about narrative and science instruction at a conference next month. Great stuff. #TeachWriting
Thank you so much for joining us tonight! We appreciate your time, and we hope this conversation was useful! Thanks to our regulars for joining us again, and we look forward to our next chat - on Tuesday, 2/26 @9pm ET/8pm CT - see you then! #TeachWriting
Also back up claims with evidence, we listened to @upandvanished podcast. Ss had to support wh they believed the killer was with evidence #TeachWriting
The archive of this chat will be posted on Wakelet and shared to this hashtag in a few minutes by @bkuhl2you - thanks for your time, and see you again soon! #TeachWriting
Wow, that flew by. Great chatting with you all. I missed this - sorry that it's been so long! I like the monthly idea, and I hope you do too! See you near the end of February! #TeachWriting
