#Kinderchat Archive
#Kinderchat, glue, glitter, gogurt, bringing daily joy to twitter. Find us Mondays, 9 pm EST and 8:30PM London time when we talk all things Early Years!
Monday September 5, 2016
Come out, come out, wherever you are! It's time! Say hi, where you're from, and how long you have been -ing w/ us!
Come out, come out, wherever you are! It's time! Say hi, where you're from, and how long you have been -ing w/ us!
Amy here, co-founder, moderating from The Canada. Have been doing this w/ since the very beginnin. 6 years!
Hi! From Buffalo, Minnesota. I have - ed on and off for 4 years.
Hi . Meg here from Chicago. I’ve been doing the thing for a while—can’t remember how long!
Hi . Meg here from Chicago. I’ve been doing the thing for a while—can’t remember how long!
Hello! I'm Jessica from the University of Saint Mary in Kansas, and this is my very first :)
Long enough to be on our "oldtimer" list!
Welcome! We love newbies!
Hi! Kathleen from Edmonton here. I've been -ing for...5 years now? I've lost count.
Hi! Kathleen from Edmonton here. I've been -ing for...5 years now? I've lost count.
Hello from Cedarville, Oh! I'm a student in college and this is probably only my third or fourth time joining officially
6yrs is so freaky!! Can you believe that?!
Hello ! Happy Back to School Eve from Michelle in Abbotsford, BC, Canada...with y'all for five (?) years now.
Hi everyone! I think this is the start of my third year with the awesome friends!
I did my fair share of lurking for a while.
Hi! I'm Vicki from Texas and this is my first time
Hello . Lori from Missouri. Back in K this year! Woot Woot!
Does this mean we are ready for 1st grade?
Hi Kathleen! It must be 5...same as me!
Hi all changed my life in many ways. Faige retired kinder teacher. But I sub and that's where it's at!!
Yay! With you and and , it's like a reunion around here!
I’m from Western North Carolina and - ed for a couple of years. Took a self-imposed time-out last year.
Hey Kathleen; how are you feeling mama to be?!
Welcome! We are a friendly bunch, I promise!
Patricia fr Vancouver,BC, can't stay long, it's dinner time! I loathe calendar time but articles linked earlier changed my mind
Hey ! Carrie here from PEI. I think I’ve been hanging around these parts for, what? 5 years?
Glad you made home safely!
Yes! Technically we are 1st graders now! :)
Yes, I feel like things were CRAZY last year when k decided to teach 5/6 part time, 😫
Back in K after a year’s exile in third. Moved schools this year and out of a TOXIC school.
You guys. It is 7:04 on Monday. I have been doing this chat EVERY week for 6 yrs. MY MOTHER JUST CALLED.
Thanks! Yesterday was a crazy day, that's for sure. Home at 3:30am.
hi everyone, I'm Tammy from New West, BC. I have never - ed :-)
Hey! Feeling so good. A lot more tired now that school is back in. Getting ready for 🍼 tho!
Carrie!! How was the summer?!
I missed all of you VERY much. I lurked a few nights last year, but it was painful :(
Welcome! We are friendly and helpful, if loud sometimes!
It was lovely! Had so many great travels to see family and friends. How was yours?
And safe and having a good time under your belt! Good luck tomorrow
So glad you're back!!! Hooray!!!
Oh good! Always feels so good to do a nice move. 🙌🏻
I guess, really, it wouldn't be a if my mom DIDN'T call...
I fear i won’t last long though. My new school is not 3 min from my house like my old. But worth the 25 minute drive :)
I’ve missed you at the Glad to see you tonight!
Hahahahaha! Without fail!
nice!! I saw 's Ignite talk about ages ago. Great talk, but never made it here
I keep "liking" your tweets and it looks like I'm happy you were "toxic" and lurking painfully. Oy.Glad you're back!
Thanks Faige! It was a wonderful trip with a crazy ending.
Very mellow! Read a ton and just chilled out!! So nice!
You know you are always welcome, regardless of grade level, right? still plays w/us, and she is in 3rd!
Wow! So many new faces. Welcome all!
Hi Tammy! Great to see you here. :-)
hey kinder peeps...happy to be heading back to the littles tomorrow. Summer was AH MAY ZING but time to head back and learn
Also, snarky. Occasionally. 😉
You survived the heat of another IL summer? I almost died when we were there!
Great! Happy to be home (long travel day) after a fabulous trip to Florida and the Caribbean.
Same here! Ready for the routine… even if it does mean early rising
I knew, but it was depressing. I yearned so much to be in kinder.
I did; though now it’s back in full force this week!
TIRED! 24 hour travel day coming home yesterday. Great trip to Florida and the Caribbean.
You and all your island travels!! Nice!!
Q1. Tonight, we talk calendar routines & how/whether to quit. So, 1st Q: do you DO calendar, & how long does it take per day?
tried for a couple days 2 get up early...it didn't work out as planned.I have lots of coffee on hand 4 tomorrow
Snarky? LOL I can’t imagine!
Next island to visit...MANHATTAN!
the world traveler! Look at you! I went to… Illinois! Not nearly as exciting as Florida and the Caribbean
A1 We have a calendar that we use to mark our time together, share events, etc. Takes 5 minutes max
It's a great island for sure! Don't go in summer though!
So happy to be joining again! I taught 1st last year at a new school. I didn't get on due to all the new stuff!
A1 I’m debating calendar this year. I had read both articles a while ago. But calendar time is more than just calendar.
It’s the worst. I’m headed to Seattle next weekend and can’t wait for the cooler weather.
Haaaaaa https://t.co/JYlpNaNtrx
You guys. It is 7:04 on Monday. I have been doing this chat EVERY week for 6 yrs. MY MOTHER JUST CALLED.
Next March, baby! Maybe we should meet up?
I've gotten calendar down to 7 minutes but still can't stand it.
I hear ya! For 3 hours this summer all 5 of us were in the same place. First time in 3 YEARS!
https://t.co/9UjrWs9lk0
I 'do calendar' but it lasts 5 mins tops. Mostly check for upcoming Bdays, events, schedule changes, etc.
A1: I quit calendar about 6 years ago and never looked back. Moment of realization: kids couldn't transfer calendar "knowledge".
My travels start on September14. Off to granddaughter's bat mitzvah and staying there for a bit.
Q1 I have a calendar like for a desk/larger and we write special events at the beginning of the month refer to it every few days
A1 as a student, I can't say I have a classroom to do calendar time in, but my practicum classroom does and it's about 5 minutes
A1 I do calendar it's in our Saxon curriculum but I try to keep it 15 min max!
Haaa! I liked em too!! Just so glad she's back after such a rough year and school!
That's why we decided to go. One last hurrah before we get busy with life. It was wonderful.
Hello from northern Saskatchewan, I'm very distracted this evening, making huge batches of play dough for our first day tomorrow
A1: I do “Morning Meeting” But we mostly talk and sing. They know what day it is because of specialists
At the beginning of the year, calendar takes a lot of time because kids have lots of questions but it goes fast at the end
Ha! RT : I guess, really, it wouldn't be a if my mom DIDN'T call...
Of course!! I'm not far! :)
A1- did as a classroom T but constantly trying to make it shorter and more interactive. Want kids doing not watching
I use a real calendar & put important dates on it... if I am bored at calendar time I can only imagine the littles
It's full on fall weather here already. Coats and pants and everything - brrrr! 🍂
bwahaha your mom is consistent :)
I ask for a play dough coordinator and that changed my life. I do make the first batch though!
that's what's been bothering me so I'll give it up and change it to something else
If we had a bingo card, "Amy's mom calls" would be on it!
I went to the beach today, but it’s just that much too chilly to swim. Saw starfish though!
A1 Both school I sub do calendar but now more as Responsive Classroom format so actual calendar changing w/less time
A1: I quit calendar my first semester into grad school (4 years ago) and haven’t looked back.
Q2: Do your standards have explicitly calendar-related outcomes? Or do you use calendar as a way to teach OTHER math outcomes?
A1 I have a large wall whole year calendar but we don't "do" calendar. It's a tool.
oooohhhh I like that...a play dough co-ordinator.
Is it really?! Wow!! Just getting nice here and not steam bath-like 😳
Hi Melva!! Are you back in K?
I did post a full year of months on my wall 2 years ago in kinder and it worked out great. Weird order though August - July
Yes. Impt not to confuse morning meeting/gathering w/calendar. Can have mtg w/no calendar!
Pseudo A2 What are these standards of which you speak?
A2: When I did calendar I used it as a tool to teach other math outcomes. Then I realized it really wasn’t doing that.
I think a bingo card should be one of our little projects. “Amy’s mom calls” could be center square :)
I give them all the supplies and the recipe. And they get to pick the colour and everything!
how big did you make the calendars. If I make them 11X17, is there enough room?
In The Canada, those would be the almighty Prog of Studies!
A2 definitely for other math outcomes. The common core isn’t very calendar oriented. Of course I hate CC for other reasons.
I was thinking the same thing! Because it’s almost a freebie, right?
I actually made them only 8-1/2x11, but they needed to be bigger. We put post-its on the side and did arrows.
Have you asked kids to explain how 100 chart & calendar are diff? Mine were STUMPED. I quit calendar short after.
This idea is like the bombdigity!
Oh, that. A2 I'll check the Program Statement. We like to know what day it is and see what's coming up
I didn’t (and still don’t) have enough wall space)
lucky you I'm still in third & kids for this year look great, but admin? ... .
I'm here! Liane from Abbotsford, BCSorry for the lateness but pre-school starting pancake puppies had to be eaten!
A2: There are ZERO things in state early learning standards that say to do calendar in preK, yet many people told to do it.
A2 (ish): I no longer do calendar or 100 days. Not in the outcomes, and not dev. app in my opinion
A2 school using new math program so calendar not for math outcomes but integrated into math curriculum, if I got it right.
Q3: Do your students enjoy your calendar routine? Do they appear engaged & interested? Do YOU enjoy it?
My months are 8 1/2 x 11...it's all the room I have. It works fine. I print small.
THIS IS THE SONG OF MY PEOPLE. https://t.co/7PDdNeOTel
A2 (ish): I no longer do calendar or 100 days. Not in the outcomes, and not dev. app in my opinion
Hi all. Popping in from Windsor, Ontario. Going into my 6th year teaching JK/SK
I start calendar in January- we get it as a class gift when they come back from break! :)
Yes! Way to stay strong for DAP! https://t.co/njaRDk5T9P
A2 (ish): I no longer do calendar or 100 days. Not in the outcomes, and not dev. app in my opinion
I do count the days of school w/sticks and bundles of 10s. It's not curriculum. I don't do a celebration day.
I’m sorry. weird part is I got my requested transfer & then my principal (old school) got transferred!
hi Michelle, no still in 3
I often muse about how calendar is so ubiquitous in K & early elem. We do it bc everyone does...?
A2 The CC does not have calendar as a standard. I integrate other things. I'm the only k teacher w/o a calendar on my wall.
I'm doing that again this year. Only did September to July due to the calendar I had.
I hate to leave it until then what with birthdays and all (counting days until xmas, etc.)
A3: Even when I taught 1st grade kids hated calendar time. I hated calendar time, but I was a new teacher and it’s what we did.
A3: I have found there are many more valuable tasks that we enjoy much more compared to calendar-esque time.
I'll see if I have room for 11X17. Since I'm tossing the calendar, I might as well go all out, right?
A3 We talk about important dates. Count to birthdays, field trips, etc. Exciting things! Kids love and want to do it themselves.
It may be a throwback to Math Their Way? Circa 1976? It was a big part of my MTW training in 1984.
100th day is SO DUMB. But it’s pretty much a common mandate around here.
Have wondered if that was the origin! Fascinating!
A3 I used to do Math Their Way calendar activities. I hated them, the kids were bored.
And yet we tell the kids that it’s not okay to do something just because someone else is… https://t.co/4MJh0o1ThK
I often muse about how calendar is so ubiquitous in K & early elem. We do it bc everyone does...?
There are so many things we do because “everyone” does. Sounds like a good chat topic!
I still love MTW. It was a revolutionary set of ideas.
A3 In the classes I have spent much time in, it never seems to be much of a hit.
is now trending in Canada, ranking 24
There were too many of them!
Careful there, lady! I'll sign you up!
A3 not sure w/100 day in new math program or how calendar & counting will be used. My idea of calendar was very quick.
That's what I love the calendar for. They are so invested in knowing what is coming up!
I do like elements of Math Their Way though.
We do a morning check in after about an 30-50 minutes of exploration as a soft start. Do some breathing and "yoga".
Calendar/Day100- I find when people ask why they do it, no one has a decent answer. Just because that’s what’s done?
Too many activities and not relevant to a five year old.
Yes, I have a new grade partner this yr & some explanation has happened around "just bc everyone else does..."
I work with a strong K team who truly understand DAP. Plus, they know I just do me, lol!
You, my friend, are in my brain.
If I know what topics we will be studying, I will often put that up. If they want to learn something, I try to put it up too
A3 One year when I taught first, we had calendar books and the kids loved them FOR A MONTH. Then bored.
you me and We’re kinder triplets!
A3 Saxon is so boring and the calendar routine is too! The word fidelity has been coming down so I do it as quick as possible!
I’ve told my teachers that “I've always done it that way” isn’t a good enough answer when I ask them questions.
I kind of feel like once kids “get” calendar concepts, we don’t need to beat a dead horse
I had the same worry years ago. Supportive principal encouraged me to change and to be the change.
Yes, I think that the way we "do" calendar is heavily influenced by Math Their Way.
Yes. I used it in the early 80s, I was teaching G1/2.Still not all that DAP. Use of manips in math was new to me
100day became makerspace/geniushour activity. Collaborative outcome 4kinders Good stuff happened.
Supportive people in the building helps A LOT!
I know it was when I did it
Understanding a calendar is part of our gr 3 outcomes for measurement unit - despite having "done" it for 4 yrs they struggle
Fidelity. A four letter word!!!!
Love the manipulative, but always annoyed by having to make the "games". LOL!
I would help moderate that chat, if you wanted.....
There's some great stuff in Math Their Way for sure!
Love that idea! I might be able to “sell” that at my current school.
Maybe they struggle because it wasn’t relevant to them up to this point?
Math is fun, Michelle. ;-)
Sounds like we've got a winner!! :)
Aha! There's confirmation right there I suppose.
Yes! Fill that time with something that’s more relevant to them!
I’ll try to remember to post it on the google doc
I love Math! I'm just too lazy to colour and make the game pieces.
Let me know when! I'll try to move any meetings from that day.
Absolutely! RT : I do like elements of Math Their Way though.
I think it's b/c they don't use real calendars & so many teachers don't even put up all the days of the month
To be clear: am not advocating against HAVING & USING a calendar. Just against "doing calendar" every day.
That’s true enough! If they can’t see it, how do they know it?
Q4: How well does your calendar routine reflect & model the purpose and real use of a calendar in the adult world?
Lol! Rob used to cut pattern blocks for me as we watch tv. Yikes.
100% Agreed here! https://t.co/tFXgyB5Lfp
To be clear: am not advocating against HAVING & USING a calendar. Just against "doing calendar" every day.
Exactly. Blargh. I refuse to do that. LOL!
A4: We use a calendar to show what we might be doing that day, when an important event is, etc. I try to use it like I do for me
A4 We check the class calendar every day just like adults check their daytimers or calendar apps. It's a tool.
A4 I’m going to make it reflect. OHHHH we just need an online calendar then. That’s what all their parents use!
A to Q4: It doesn't LOL! Time to change
A4 I still use a paper calendar and a day timer so writing on our paper classroom calendar feels real-world
When teaching becomes rote then so does learning & kids don't get it. Don't understand nor conceptualize
I think that’s a right of passage for K teachers of our generation, lol!
Lazy kinder teachers unite!!!
I love it when annually challenges the calendar routine! :)
I see value of using a calendar like adults do, but I had to draw line when my 2 yr old teachers were doing calendar.
A4: We are using a taken apart desk calendar to identify when we have things like gym, library, birthdays, etc so we can plan
that stupid birthday cake thing!!!
And also so that we can see how much time has passed and how long it is until events.
Also on the list of "don't waste my time"...colouring big books! 😝
My students use calendar to track special events, count down how many "sleeps", etc.
Yes! Planning! I couldn’t think of that word.
It is sort of a tradition - I put it in my calendar so I remember! (See what I did there?)
A4 When it does use that focus the rest takes up important play time.
Oh dear lord. 2 YEAR OLDS????
I actually don't like big books in general. I do like colouring stuff though.
Oh, don’t even get me started on what was happening to my 2 yr olds. We had lots of reflection and change.
I don't mind big books, as such, but storing them drives me crazy. Not enough room!
You know what I like? Labels! And printing off name labels so I don’t have to write the names !
Tell me why you don’t like big books. Not authentic in size?
I stand them up in a rubbermaid container
I’ve successfully challenged all teachers to reflect on DAP of calendar in PreK except one.
I love big books. I can colour those and not stress! We all have our "things", don't we?
I love labels, too! I can't wait to get my class list so I can do that.
I like big books- kids are always engaged with them, and I leave them out for them to use
Trying to insert a glucose sensor and tweet is challenging. BRB.
yes, though I do get the "shared reading" thing. Just feel weird. It's ok-I'm weird.
I never had many, but this year I finally have access. They are hard to store!
LOL! Colouring stresses me out. I am terrible at it.
What do you mean “Colour big books”? Serious question. I don’t understand!
the calendarizing of "math their way" is a great example of how repetition can replace ritual
BTW I'm subbing for 2hours tomorrow w/youngest, not yet in toddlers. Ts n PD before school on Wed
Except when you print them out then someone switches from PM class to AM class... 🙈
I think I will move my calendar over by the schedule and keep the 100 chart where it is by the 10 frames, etc.
Where your running shoes! Have fun! :)
My friends and I use Starfall calendar
You can draw your own and colour however you want!
We buy big books at are black lined, colour them in. Cheaper than published book.
NOOOOOO!!!! That’s what I imagine you yelling!
Are we talking colouring? I LOVE colouring!
Yes, then leave it a week to make sure no one else changes, hehe!
Not sure your reference in coloring & big books
We are kinda off topic. Sorry.
Q5: If you have already quit doing calendar: how long ago, why, what do you do instead?
I never knew there was such a thing! You West Coasters are full of info!
I, too, love colouring. It’s peaceful for me.
I was the kid who never coloured in colouring books because I couldn't do it neatly.
Me either, but now I LOVE my Harry Potter coloring book!
hope all is well. My 12th year in K
A5 We talk about what we did on our non Kinder day and then we talk about the plan for our day
A5: I quit DOING calendar, and started USING calendar 5(?) yrs ago. LIFE CHANGING.
A5: We spend our time giving one classmate 3 compliments that we type on a Word doc and email to the parents.
A5: we talk about our day ahead, or the week. We talk about what we did at home. We sing some songs. We talk & sing some more.
Hi Ryan! Nice to see you back at :-)
I LOVED COLORING a big strength for me through elementary school not other stuff
A5: Quit calendar routines 2 or 3 years ago. We changed it to a morning meeting and dance party first, now we use it as check in
This! RT : A5: I quit DOING calendar, and started USING calendar 5(?) yrs ago. LIFE CHANGING.
Coloring instead of calendar or did I miss a topic switch?
I sense a wonderful singing theme here!
A5: Quit calendar 4ish years ago. Lots of talking, singing, dancing, and reading in the mornings.
Mr Flinn!! How are you?! The kids are so big now from your photo!! Wow! You still drawing?! Loved your drawing!
We started using calendar time for more meaningful & accurate math activities.
No, sorry-we got a little off topic. We sometimes do that.
I think this will be life changing!
What a neat idea! Ive see the compliment or comment used as part of RC https://t.co/pvBBTnWKb1
A5: We spend our time giving one classmate 3 compliments that we type on a Word doc and email to the parents.
I feel like 100 Day in K could be a whole chat unto itself.
I have never done "Calendar" or sung the songs. We do a morning message. I find our class schedule holds more meaning for K's.
Plus, thanks , calendar is my fav rant launch into the importance of rituals rather than rote :)
My class is like a musical!
I wanna know where is tonight?!
I love that post of yours. That post is what made me start to rethink why I do it.
Never felt good about doing calendar in PreK, but didn’t have words to defend myself until grad school and am calendar free.
Any chance I can talk you into doing a chat about the difference & importance?
We are always talking about time, planets and the earths rotation! Shadows, etc!
Mine is like a soap opera! The Young and the Restless
remember our half a year chat? That has been a fiddled with concept for me for a while now - need reignited.
When we know why but can’t express it. Reminds me of so many students, right?
Questioning rituals is so important.Just like questioning why we ALL have to do the same thing.
I can play that theme song on the piano. Just, you know, in case you were wondering… lol
Victor Newman would be impressed for sure!
Such a great point! https://t.co/SFs66INzj8
Questioning rituals is so important.Just like questioning why we ALL have to do the same thing.
Also, as a younger teacher, I didn’t have confidence to say no/suggest alternatives when told to do something.
oh yea baby. Ritual is the heart of a great community. Let's see if we can wreck that word too :)
That's double why I start calendar in January leads to a nice unit w winter, shadows and measuring time
I am loving the old school chat tonight :) RT : Hi all :)
Halfway Day is now a well-established K tradition at my school, and I LOVE IT.
Questioning everything is what got me exiled to third grade :)
I still question!!!
Q5 is a biggie: What would happen if you did quit calendar? Even just for a week?
oh my gosh really?! It goes so fast!!! I loved your videos!
We meet and do character building activity every morning. We count, dance with gonoodle, and learn how to be a caring community
oh dear, I am loooooong past 40 :) now we need a poll to see how old peeps are
Hmm like half birthdays 🎂
JONATHAN I ASSUME YOU HAVE A TARDY SLIP NOW MOVE YOUR CLIP TO YELLOW.
how about a "50s" theme kindergarten graduation?!?
Q5 If I quit, I’m betting no one would notice.
Good things. Less stress for kids, more time for play, more time for actual math instead of rote. https://t.co/JSSaIykXZF
Q5 is a biggie: What would happen if you did quit calendar? Even just for a week?
A5: The walls would crumble down. Just kidding. No one cared that I stopped doing it
I also do chant "5 days school, 2 days no school, 5 days school, 2 days no school, 5 days..."
is in the house...we getting the band back together
A5 I quit calendar five years ago and the world didn't implode. It's all good.
As the oldest person here (along with I protest this question. :)
On Fridays we do this cheer. We start soft and grow to yelling: It’s Friday, It’s Friday It’s REALLY REALLY FRIDAY
I have shoes that are 40 years old, you guys.
couldn't let be the only boy here tonight.
HAHAHA I’m sure I do, too!!! I have wrinkles that old!!
Yours for the picking, lady! And let me know when you can mod about rituals!
I just recalled that a now retired K consultant in our board referred to the routine as "death by calendar" at a workshop. 😂😂
Still the concept but not the physical thing I use fingers 1=mOnday 2=twos day 3- (three middle fingers look like a W)
Our littles don’t need calendar; I just want the little kids to know what order things happen in their day so they feel secure.
A5 autonomy at my school. No walls will collapse. It really has become something that's always been done But changes happening
I try! hehehe ;-) But for some reason, no one seems to question me… hmmm… So I just do my thing
Truth: MOVE YOUR CLIP TO GLITTER I AM SO HAPPY TO SEE YOU!
Must go, ...I have to pick out what I am going to wear for the FIRST DAY OF SCHOOL tomorrow! Have a great week!
did I tell you we now have three male Kindergarten teachers in our building?
A classroom without calendar routines??? THE WORLD WILL END! (Insert sarcasm font there)
Thursday = fours day Friday= hold up all five and wave "have a good weekend!"
That is a great phrase. I may steal it…
Ha ha. Did you notice how quiet I was when this came up https://t.co/qJomxv6ssM
As the oldest person here (along with I protest this question. :)
Have a great first day at school, Michelle!
what?! Awesome. We're still sitting at two!
it it 3? Is 3 next? Wait 5!!!?? I AM FIVE
We all wear our school t-shirts. Makes one less chore! Have a great day!!
Age is just a number for the calendar
Time to wrap up, friends. Tks for a great 1st chat of the year! And don't be afraid to be a quitter!
Before I go, please take a minute to VOTE for the book for our book chat! So far, there is a near tie for 2 of the books.
All of September I do movement games instead then news or what working on, schedule for day
Feel free to share your blog, or any site you love.
Have a good night everyone! 😊
Thanks for all the fun! I missed my Monday meet ups!
where does one find the choices?
Sorry, I have to go too . Sensor is icky and I need to go figure this out so I have a good week at school Happy back to school!
oops where can I find the list
I don't KNOW WHICH ONE TO VOTE FOR!!!!!!
So happy to be back at the ! Have a great first day to some of you, a great week to all of you!
Made it to the end! SOOO good to be back
Thanks everyone that has worked countless hours to make their classrooms, communities, and the world just a little better place
Next week, we talk reading in K (is it really DAP?), w/ . Y'all come back now!
