#RuralEdChat Archive
#RuralEdChat is a chat that focuses on the needs of the rural educator. This chat has been revised by Tammy Neil (@MathNeil), John Martin (@edventures) and Natalee Stotz (@nataleestotz).
Tuesday July 26, 2016
Good evening Robin here from WI kicking things off on behalf of our co-moderating team of &
Hey Linda! Thanks for stopping by.
Tonight is no. 2 for Better Conversations by . It’s the least pressure you’ll ever have in a book group!
Hey, ! Pulling myself away from 's amazing book THE SERPENT KING. Highly recommend it!
Aloha friends, it's John back from a crazy week of learning at & another at . I'm a tired puppy!
You encouraged me by saying I almost didn't need to read the book!
We welcome every1 2 whether u’ve read book or not! Conversation can continu on our fb page & in our Voxer group.Links 2 follow.
We seriously mean that, too! did the heavy lifting on some gr8 quotes tonight to inspire our convo.
Hi , Jody in Quebec ready to discuss Better conversations
Share a a tweet of something you learned at either, please.
It's on my list! Second enthusiastic review from a kindred reader in about a week. Cool!
John! You have been busy! and you are both packing and unpacking a lot lately, right?
Let’s see who is joining us tonight for . If you would, please introduce yourself and let us know where you’re from.
I relearned & built a tiny drone w/ at
Bless you, Natalee. I'm almost at the "I can't pick up another book" stage.
Hi Jody! Thanks so much for returning to our conversation about this book! How's it going for you?
Dove deeper into our competency based learning journey w/ my team
You HAVE 2 read this. 1 of the best I've read this year. Started this afternoon. Will finish 2nite
Really enjoying the book. Reading dig & considering getting paper copy. So pertinent to coaching conversations
Hi , I'm Melissa, gearing up for yr 2 at a high school in Crozet, VA, in the Blue Ridge Mtns.
The work you've been doing collaboratively on the CBL is inspiring!
Welcome, Melissa! Thanks so much for joining us.
appreciate you and the other leaders!
I keeping nodding and nodding along, especially as we watch the political hoopla here. So relevant!
My pleasure. I have a bit of a book/reading addiction.
Sorry, forgot to say I'm a school librarian
We’ll use a Q1 & R1 format for “Quote & Response” Don’t forget to tag your responses w/
Yes, exciting times for you folk. Must be very different than watching from the outside
yay for that! Just read the AASL resolutions re: librarians for every school, rural ed systems mentioned!
It looks quite similar. Also check out
Reading is the best addiction ever! Well, next to coffee & chocolate!
resolutions..wishes....horses...ride... but yes: necessary but sadly not sufficient to hv resolution re staffing
I have a confession friends. In all my travels I've not yet read our book. But I'll be interested in learning your takeaways!
R1: This makes me think about perception. What we believe becomes what we perceive. We rarely know the whole story.
oh how true! And how quickly we move to superimpose our story on others?
I've only 5 more novels to read and review of 1900-1969 bestselling novels.
Amazing. Are you serious on this? How many were on the list? And which list?
R1: So we really need to change the lens through which we see things in order to have empathy
Thanks will check it out.
This is a great question even w/o the book!
That sounds like a fine task!
yes, and how hard it is sometimes to listen and not try to fix things
See? Told ya so! Promised to make this an inclusive (with credit to for the quotes idea)
R1: Also, implies that we need to let go of making sense and just focus on the empathy piece. Just accept, not try to label
True! And often don't really listen to what is being said, but for what want to hear or how to answer
as I read this part struck me how much we need to set aside in order to have real relationship-blding convos
quotes idea perfect for discussion - usually I don't like them, but really works for this
which is so hard in itself.
It's really hard to ask folks to add things to precious summer hrs. This might spark a future read
wow! even just keeping track of all that is something!!
Bill is in our twitter space! and Hi, Bill!
R1Also true that empathy can interfere with ability to see the world as it is?
I'd say we also need to learn to be aware of multiple lenses - decenter our own perpsectives.
I'll hang with you in the back of the room!
R1 So lots is said about empathy, but my fav idea lately is how much it demands of the imagination & cognitive commitment.
Exactly - we want things to make sense, but empathy is not about sense, it is about how the other experiences
which begs the question, how do we learn to look thru the eyes and feelings of another?
Are we going to do a Statler and Waldorf thing? Or just be ourselves? :-)
& empathy isn't necessarily prob-solving (at 1st). We tend to jump over building understanding part
and I didn't read it yet either but I did put it on my Alibris wish list!
Indeed. In so many social justice spaces (e.g. ), advice is ask what is needed.
fits in w talk earlier today re civic engagement, Ss - getting those "in" govt to listen to those "out"
R1 As edus (teachers & colleagues of teachers) how do we push out of the rushed zone of listening into empathy space?
and provide both the space and the time to do it honestly?
It's got to become a mindset. Easy-ish for me - my voice tends to engageg slowly (some sort of brain issue).
Literature, of course, and visual arts are good training grounds
R1 What we observe is not nature itself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning. (Heisenberg) Empathy=method of quest?
Bill we need to sit down and share a coffee some day!
Start by committing to listen without talking. Be aware of own bias & push past judgments to really hear msg
Hi Amy. Questioning method is key, I think! absolutely.
this is heart of it - the time and work pressures, the segregation of interests - work against time to connect
Yes, and it's not necessarily about agreeing, either.
oh so much. then connecting lit & art to current related conversations in communities
That seems key. I find it helps to get not just at what people think but how they think - perhaps with (non-judgmental) whys.
exactly. Knight helped many in the study become aware of being still & hearing vs. judging & responding
No kidding. What part of New Hampshire are you in again?
This challenged me. Tend to make noises to indicate I'm listening. Not necessary. Want to be quiet! https://t.co/1I5qdbgzYa
Start by committing to listen without talking. Be aware of own bias & push past judgments to really hear msg
And inviting communities to bring their conversations into our art spaces
Can be about exploring common ground, areas of difference, and the respectful why.
Lake Winnipesaukee is my home. I live up in Sandwich.
Me too! I want to offer examples to show that I understand or to clarify. Need to get other person's, not mine
Eye contact and nodding can help, too (depending on culture).
yes, and I'm always with the nodding. :)
except if it actually separates u fr hearing message. Sometimes I get caught up in affirming vs. hearing?
so much good material. So little time in my summer! This may be a great fall revisit for
I think the eye contact is more important than verbal affirmation. Just Listen!
I do think, as teachers, we have some responsibility to not just listen but also be ready to step in.
Sorry! It's another but really worth it. Talks about love, Einstein & true dialog.
The essence of understanding another's heart.
good point! affirming can get in the way of hearing...I'm guilty of that
yes, which leads us to our next quote!
I'm guilty of that. Need to slow my mind as it is always searching for the "fix".
My dad wrote a book called "Basic Attending Skills" which I proofread as a teenager. Still in print. Solid foundation.
True in some cases. The trick is to learn when.
think that was 1 of most convicting things for me from the chapter. https://t.co/jil6RhWlsL
good point! affirming can get in the way of hearing...I'm guilty of that
Just discovered the tag today. Usually in class Tuesdays but really interested to follow the feed. https://t.co/QNj2A5zZ9Y
Are you an educator interested in issues in Rural Education? Join us for on Tuesdays at 8:30pm est. https://t.co/NauB89mzl9
True that. And as with so many things, it varies by class, by day, by topic...
who has seen the post on labels? This reminds me of that in a profound way.
& i think that's naturl!Fixng stuff matters!We just have 2 figr out where it fits?If it fits?
https://t.co/FqZsLqUdC6
Let’s see who is joining us tonight for . If you would, please introduce yourself and let us know where you’re from.
Hi Jolene! Thanks for following along. We're here every other Tues. in the summer & weekly beginning in Sept.
Welcome aboard! Our family is strong and always welcomes new voices!
Glad you found us! Normally meet ever Tues. Summer is lighter schedule. Tonight discussing Better Conversations.
I see a lot of "blame the learners" stuff happening, not just in schls - seeing others as fully human is vital
that's pretty cool. I'm pretty sure we don't teach or model these skills as much as we might. s/o to Mr. Ivey Sr
I wonder how often we're in the fix it mode with Ss and we don't really listen to them
R2: Was interesting to wrap mind around lack of empathy as dehumanizing. How easy to skip empathy when busy/preoccupied, but...
R2 Work took me from liberal Western MA to central Appalachian coal country. Cost of dehumanization has become clearer.
blame is in the category of quick responses. And easy, right? Hard to shift this mindset in our culture! Vital tho.
A2 Have to build a mindset where empathy for the undiscovered human being within takes precedence over any initial impression.
Hello . It's Polly from central Wisconsin. Come to lurk again. All this talk of Better Conversations sounds so civilized.
so does that make us mentalists or miracle workers?
Just discovered a few weeks ago myself. Has been a great, welcoming group!
Good question. One on one, it's easier. Group dynamics can be devilishly tricky.
I hv strong interests in usability & putting students in productive roles - helps them to be seen, to contribute
&constraints lead 2"Next?Who else needs help?"assembly linemodel support vs attending deeply
Neither.
Oh, I kill myself.
That's my fear. That in my mind working that I'm missing what is needed which is just a human connection.
R1 either I don't see empathy is so powerful or I don't understand empathy as other than a 1:1 expression. Must think more
BTW, I'm Amy - 1/2 of & Communications Director for theater wing - Whitesburg, KY
Yes. We simply must. https://t.co/2SZmoE9uRh
A2 Have to build a mindset where empathy for the undiscovered human being within takes precedence over any initial impression.
I sometimes do - I think kids have more of an instinct for this than we sometimes imagine.
Hey Polly! Happy you are here. We try our best to be civilized. Happy you are here for
We are on our best behavior tonight! ;)
first Twitter chat since I've been dealing w mild concussion, things moving fast
This was my challenge with Q2 - need to have empathy in every conversation or else dehumanizing the other is big
they definitely help us see when we aren't attending. Not always in words, but nonverbals. Kids as
got it, yes - slowing down responses is a big help.
Great response, John! Still chuckling.
We can be leisurely or rapid - tonight is one of the rapid nights, for sure!
Distracted by books and ice cream. I'm back now.
Thanks for oh dear! I hope your recovery is going well? Ouch.
(can't multi-task enough to look up mentalist - not the same as mental, right?)
oooooo....I like that. Good point. Deep.
thx, R. I'm much better, can multi-task w paper - encouraging (rear-ended, bad driver)
Hi John. That's an interesting perspective. Schools can definitely be top-down in conversations across the board.
Isn't a "mentalist" a mind-reader??????
Very glad to hear that you're on the mend!
I thought it's some1 focused on understandng others' pov? Some1 take to the google?
with hint of Mesmer? or no?
I like the concept of situationally shifting leadership roles. Kids often naturally adopt these.
Thanks to a strong understanding of human psyche and observation.
Thanks! Could hv been much worse. Glad the rhyming stage is over ;)
1. magician, esp. mind-reader. 2. eccentric person.
Ha!
So the 3rd quote is coming up. Crazy that we are rounding the bend on an hour?!
That went fast! Great discussions tonight!
Such a fun journey with our friends tonight!
The ability to slow down and really listen, to give the other speaker what they deserve - we need to tch our students tht focus
Q3 Consider ourselves first? What does this look like or feel like to you in your teaching life? https://t.co/7b6o0x90TE
I so agree. Appreciate depth v breadth. Wish we were campfiring together.
Glad we spent more time discussing each other's ideas & fewer quotes - is in spirit of the book!
I will not let myself go look up Meinong and Russell and uh, other stuff
A3 My historic weakness - cut myself little to no slack. Working on that- horrific role-modeling.
(Arggh - see what I mean?)
exactly! I swear it was all planned that way (*wide-eyed realization that it wasn't!*)
Q3: I think this gets at our earlier convo on empathy for others. We need to understand ourselves & our biases first.
I could use some of that flair sometimes, in my library
Bingo. https://t.co/yZXKGRdrY3
Q3: I think this gets at our earlier convo on empathy for others. We need to understand ourselves & our biases first.
Still waiting for a family reunion!
R3 I really must read this book. Beginning to feel I don't understand word empathy as author does.
Empathic! I can't be, it's against my nature.
Why're we so dang hard on ourselves?It's almost epidemic, right?Saw something today on how ads make us always Q adequacy
The MiddleTalk group has done that three times - essentially unconferences before they were a thing.
If I were still in K-5, I'd hv some lessons re cultures that do and don't interrupt
It really is worth having and reading. Even if it take you a while or you do it in piece.
or even how others apply it. Same holds true for the term for me.
That's a major theme pretty much every year when working with 7th grade girls. They're both aware and taken in.
He takes it in some important directions that I hadn't considered that impact conversations for sure.
R3: Recognize own position before can understand another. Assess own pro-tech, connected angle before empathize with anxious Ts
R3 I recall feeling mortification, vulnerability, when knowledge was weaponized against me & avoid re-enacting w/students.
would be very worthy of studies.
Heck, *I'm* both aware and taken in (affected, however you want to phrase it).
Piece by piece is my mode on this one. Takes some rereading & reflection for me.
My dictionary says empathy is projecting our feelings onto another in order to understand that person better
ooh. I want to learn more!
A just-graduated Senior says our school graduates not stereotypically angry but rather "frustrated" feminists.
R3: Part of empathizing with self is being able to recognize so can set aside in order to empathize with a different position
Navajo come to mind (thx to Tony Hillerman novels). My Irish family - full of v articulate interruptions
Yes. And attend to how that comes across if other person/people have other perspectives. Reduce the anxiety.
The value of reconnecting to our own studenthood is huge. Breaking those cycles.
Wow! is my clock right? it's 9:30 already
