#edchat Archive
#Edchat is a hashtag, a movement—it is a weekly organized Twitter discussion of educators and people interested in education that meet virtually from all over the world. #Edchat serves as a conversation thread on Twitter and is also used for organized weekly discussions.
Tuesday July 5, 2016
Current Topic: Are punitive grades or zeroes necessary to create compliant students? What are the potential positives and negatives?
WELCOME to Are punitive grades or zeroes necessary to create compliant students? What are the potential positives and negatives?
Now Topic: Are punitive grades or zeroes necessary to create compliant students? What are the potential positives and negatives?
Topic: Are punitive grades or zeroes necessary to create compliant students? What are the potential positives and negatives?
Jeremey HS env sci and bio. Exp this year with 59% in place of zeros. Hard to get great grades but difficult to fail.
a) Prerequisite: A desire for compliant students. If it's what you want, then yes, punitive grades or zeroes are very helpful...1/3
I need another means of alerting students and parents about engagement & growth
It depends on the home. Parents who are involved step in and it can make a diff. But some won't and kids drown
b) Positives include i) very easy to do (binary), ii) absolute, iii) easy to explain (to parents, for example), iv) compliant Ss.
the current software only allows for 0/missing to get noticed until I correct
Kevin here a Teaching Principal of multi classes in a rural Irish Primary school
How many zeroes should a student get before the teacher recognizes that it is not working for this student?
I don't mark down for late work and always out in full grade when completed
WHY is it so difficult for the field of education to reach agreement about the value of grades?
c) Negatives include i) Ss grade does not reflect ability, ii) this rigidity does not reflect reality, iii) compliant students. 3/3
Grades less important when content and lessons/ projects/case studies piqued as interest. Still, grades still reality & 0s not good
Why would the exposure decrease once on the work market?
In progress - Are punitive grades or zeroes necessary to create compliant students? What are the potential positives and negatives?
What to do when GRADES don't make the grade for learners (and teachers)?
Looking to have your Ss be better at peer editing? Want authentic audiences? To build empathy? https://t.co/LieGV7qfGB
If a student has a 100 average but gets zeroes for not doing Hmwk b/c he sees no need, is it appropriate to give him less than 100%?
I agree- 0's are easily notice in the gradebook- but easy to change as well!
So where does mastery fit into the grading process?
This is absolutely true. The Ps who most need to attend OH are mostly nowhere to be found.
hello! always looking for a better way to monitor growth
I think there does have to be a consequence for not completing work, but I think some Ts use 0s as an easy out.
Cleary represents below exp, but more similar to an f in a 4.0 scale. 0/100 overly punitive
I wait for two. If there is only one and it's not representative it gets forgiven anyway.
Because we are trying to quantify the unquantifiable. How much of what a S is and does is lost when we use a no.
We have to follow up the zero. Mandatory work sessions to complete the assignment at lunch or afterschool.
We end up inventing our own rules, rules we can live with, and then we are systemically inconsistent. Also bad.
What about the kid who does ALL of the homework, yet still fails tests while giving top effort?
We need to assure colleges and employers that a diploma means Ss have mastered work completion and follow through.
Well, as the main goal of learning. Getting there is the conundrum. Rigid standards based mastery is tough.
this almost destroyed my son. https://t.co/Fel6qgz294
If a student has a 100 average but gets zeroes for not doing Hmwk b/c he sees no need, is it appropriate to give him less than 100%?
Yes, when fail-pass is 69-70 there are a lot of ways to fail!
But we also have to be teaching the skill of work completion and helping break down the barriers that stand in S's way.
A1: zeros for compliance is a no. If a student is not doing their work, their is a reason. A zero just hinders
I have a problem directly comparing kids in school to adults in the workplace. .
the issue continues when students give up:very real problem
No, especially if Homework was not in assessment requirement. Likely this S needs to be extended or works better on assmt
I truth use student testimonials that yes your grade will change!
Is for spelled out in a syllabus?How is it intertwined with grades/assessments also in syllabus
one! but I'd like to think I'd recognise the problem & implement some strategy to help before this...
Perhaps if the goal=compliance. But if the goal=learning then punitive tactics don't inspire, nurture or promote growth.
No today! Join us Tuesday July 12th to chat about with
. Is the hwk binary 0/1, or is it out of points, for example 12, but handing it in is automatically 12/12? This matters.
Agreed What would my boss do if I said I didn't want to fill out my inventory because I already know what is missing
if the homework is not useful to the S, why was it assigned?
Is it too late to join chat?
A1: Mastering performance expectations is about the skill and content. If Ss can master, hw completion shouldn't drop their grade
Even in high school? Where some will go directly there?
Is the for behavior/competence/cognition? How is the concept explained/described for the class?
Not at all. We are in active dialogue ATM.
Curious-if you don't give Ss 0's for missing work, what are other ways to hold them accountable- what ab the real world?
I am sorry to learn this. :(
I like to impress upon Ss the concept of mastery & how time on task means hw, even if the assessments fail to measure.
Homework will never teach responsibility.
Ss shouldn't get 0s; mathematically it's not right. But, Ss should get failing grade. I give 50 with 64 failing in my HS
Thoughts? Great thought provoking questions on right now. https://t.co/Z9hT1JJZBQ
If a student has a 100 average but gets zeroes for not doing Hmwk b/c he sees no need, is it appropriate to give him less than 100%?
No! S either needs extending or works better with assessment. I've seen some stupid meaningless homework!
Are the assessments related to the class work and homework? Disconnect a prime suspect in this case.
Does he need documentation or does he need the information?
Yes. As the T, I should be assigning meaningful hw that Ss needs. If the hw wasn't necessary for mastery, that's on me.
I can think of lots of ways that I don't follow through with tasks that don't really matter. Ss do same.
Many need guidance and support that they do not need. Most students dont deliberately buck the system.
Topic Are punitive grades or zeroes necessary to create compliant students? What are the potential positives and negatives?
What is the PURPOSE of homework? Other options to extend learning? Still using %? Standards based system?
yes, and reinforced and reviewed with parents and students every chance I get: too different from other teachers maybe
Agreed! A zero is too hard to recover from!
I can't say that giving zeros make any difference. We do not allow because we re-assess all "not meeting" work
Work and assessments are related- this is one problem I run into with Ss w/ special needs sometimes
. It seems rather unlikely, doesn't it. I did homework b/c I liked it, not just because it was assigned.
I eliminated homework a couple years ago unless it's for remediation, redos, or making up absent work.
Perhaps the better option at MS & ip, is to use HW as part of matrix to encourage ownership & self directed learning.
I know how the game is rigged, but other teachers answer to other authorities I guess
None, but that should give the teacher insight to the student. You cant hold the kid responsible for parent failure.
there should be no punitive grades related to behaviour! Behaviour charts/rewards = awful for our future society!
. Another flaw in grading for compliance is time it takes away from the T that could be spent on more meaningful feedback
Are they on an IEP and do they have assessment accommodations?
Using grades for compliance misses the point of learning. Those students who are compliant will do it for the grade.
I would prefer mastery of skills to move students along, but the Ed system would need a major paradigm shift
If students are refusing to work or learn, I want to know why? Disengagement or accountability? How do we unpack?
Are you OK with that?How do you distinguish which Ss permitted NOT to follow through?
If Ts assign meaningful work connected to their standard, then it can absorbed into the rubric for the skill https://t.co/g30NsRXM8z
Topic Are punitive grades or zeroes necessary to create compliant students? What are the potential positives and negatives?
Beyond Hmwk zeroes may be given out for behavior. Should that be reflected in an academic grade?
Engagement, more than punitive grades and zeroes, will give you compliance.
As an experienced leader I have a problem with grades only
One thing I do to balance 0s is offer extra credit projects that are an alternate way of practicing the same skills.
So the measured data that supports hw is valid too, so use this to plan the type, not eliminate it altogether
Grades not working? Perhaps try GOLD STARS ...
Giving a zero to student is about as useless a measure of mastery as the work the student did.
and I got A's on math tests and B's in class because I didn't do homework. feeling less and less comfortable w grades
It only takes a couple of 0's for a S to develop a mindset of why bother? Ss know it's impossible to dig out of that hole
Yes & yes. My coteacher & I can get creative with other assistive accomm. : ) always trying new stuff
I appreciate quality people I get to interact w/ as we lead ourselves to grow.
So, if grades don't matter, then what does a "0" signify?
I do expect Ss to review notes, study at home.
We need to separate content knowledge and skills from "success skills" behavior should not affect content portion of grade
We should not assess responsibility in an academic assessment.
Many combos possible b/c there is a slight positive correlation, but not causation, between HWK and grades.
Who fails when a student's gets zeros, the teacher or the student? Both?
Behavior will be reflected in the grade, as it well interfere with learning. Shouldn't be added in separately.
Hi Dona... and how's that working for you?
. We are deep diving on that one topic.
Ask. Give ss another option to demonstrate learning
well then, if grades are thrown out, should standards go too?
I am glad you have a coteacher and you are able to work together to sort it out and try new things!
Could be an interesting few months! - Teachers Union Boos Clinton For Charter School Comments https://t.co/RUzLVcipcd
Our school is going away from grades and uses a spectrum. Not Meeting can be re-assessed
oh, as in 'gold scores'??
but it is a valid "success skill" to give feedback on. Just don't "grade it"
where do the parents fit in this equation?
Grades tell us nothing about the students real talents
It can widen it. My Ss who work almost full time on top of school often don't have time for hw.
Am I allowed to say yes and then duck?
If the work is uninspiring, why demand compliance? Especially from a student who, in other ways, shows mastery over the subject.
I taught an honor student who said reading at home wasn't possible. She lived w/ 8 extended family members.No way to focus;too loud
... True or false: zero times zero = zero
. He's 1 of the smaller problems in this regard; we EXPECT politicians to lie. It's Ed. 'guru's' that are a bigger issue
Kids still need structure to succeed in SDL. Scaffold free choice w/graphic organizer or note taking strategy
I can't assess the academics, if they don't first learn to be responsible enough to turn in work.
Whatever is decided should be CLEAR, CONSISTENT, PUBLIC. Grades ill-constructed breed conflict.
I want Ss grades to reflect knowledge and skill, not behavior or Ts lack of ability to have student understand concept
I'm okay with the for my sci content. Ss should love science and be able to do science and interpret sci.
Just like standardized testing!
well... in many jobs employees get salary increases for longevity not performance...
When last I was in Ontario this was how report cards were prepared. Behavior received comments only, not grades.
Lurking on tonight. The topic is an important one----are punitive grades or zeroes necessary to create compliant students?
I agree with that we cannot hold students responsible for their parents' lack of support.
Get rid of grades and homework.Lets embrace STEAM.And let homework be fun as in a walk or talk with parents
My favorite take on this is "I" for "I don't know." I forget who said this.
we're also teaching in a gamified world: points are all to students
The thing that must be examined isn't punitive grades and zeroes, but the assignments that don't light fires in kids' hearts.
cool quote Oskar... so what's real? Undigested pizza?
one of two things A kid didnt understand B assignment not worth doing
My biggest problem with homework is in the assumption that teachers own students' time outside of class.
We give separate grades for work ethic and participation.
Then you are not assigning the right homework.
Let me ask, how does a zero show anything? The student already knows the work is not complete. An easy way out.
Why do we still need ? Is it still necessary?
we can only asses what students allow us to. Grades are dumb anyway. Don't mean a thing.
As a parent I've made deliberate choices about the value of hw vs. life/family experiences
true but how do we hold parents accountable ... Should they be held accountable
Alright, what Edchats are there? If there are music ones that's even better!
Agreed. I wonder if we ever get to the point that the same rules apply worldwide. MX different than ON
I do believe that teachers use grades as a weapon to punish kids though. Heck, they are even often honest about that.
Jumping in the conversation- I asked my daughter if her A in class was a true reflection of what she knew- her reply-how could it be
If it takes a village to educate kids than why do parents get a free pass?
Another in the long line of edgy schools preparing kids for the future. This one in Berlin has huge merit. https://t.co/WBikiOg9MW
I also don't like hw bc I can't give immediate feedback and can't be sure Ss are doing their own work.
lol, can you see parents coming to school for honor roll assemblies to get their awards? ;)
I read once where kids don't drop out because they are failing- they drop out because they are bored
Wouldn't there be great power in tracking "success skills" not as part of GPA but for students to put on resume/transcript
parents should be held accountable but we can't lose more S's to their lack of support. Teaching is not easy
Our students get excited about designing shoes and building products. Zeroes on routine assignments would never give them that.
so... what about classwork?
. Grades don't motivate learners. If we have to punish learning, we fail kids for sure.
Discussion going on at is great....tune in, edu-tweets!
How do your children interpret that? Does it create a tchr vs. parent dynamic?
Discussion going on at is great....tune in, edu-tweeps!
Our goal is to teach them to be college and career ready. We can't send the memo that work completion is optional.
if Ts are truly assessing hw (not just checking for completion)wouldn't that time be better spent conferring or doing small groups?
Don't get me started on that. Grades should reflect mastery. NEVER EVER used punitively!
Great question! Grades CAN matter. But do 0s matter? And when? To who? Is zero a choice?
. Here's a better question. Why would we want compliant students?
so Dennis... does the village have an idiot?
Why does HW need to be graded? Why can't it be used for other purposes? Grading HW won't MAKE Ss do it-must be meaningful
We complain about kids not having time in class to pursue their own interests, then we take time away at home?
Do we need compliance in students or more voice and choice?
MT “: . Here's a better question. Why would we want compliant students? ” … Why indeed?
or school is not made relevant to their lives
I wouldn't want zeroes, compliance, or punitive measures. What are we modeling?
I use class work as CFU and additional practice before an assessment.
Interesting that the push for HW started around the time of Sputnik
I answer myself by saying as close to 0 as possible. I ask for 10 minutes a day though.
What does the syllabus say?
Perhaps your HW was meaningful?
why? What do we teach that is that important?
. I KNOW that they aren't all doing their own work. Who is and who isn't? Homework thus provides flawed, useless data.
You keep saying compliant (which has a neg connotation). The better word is responsible. I want them to ?.
. Most jobs require the work be done completely on the job. There are exceptions but Jobs build incentives to do that.
many kids see sch as place to learn, not the home. What if we designed learning exp for HW for entire family?
can hw be ongoing tasks as part of larger, meaningful project? Similar to what I do as a professional?
yes its practice! It provides a feedback loop or conversation not a grade
Grades are a form of feedback, and students need feedback.
grades are a huge weapon against students. :(
But it's tricky to navigate
. In part it got me out of doing dishes. It was often ~25 more math problems than necessary.
Are compliant students grounds for educational malpractice?
Lets drop workbooks,worksheets and useless written homework.Lets ask our pupils to talk and engage with parents and report back
which is time-consuming motivates the best. enable SS to accept grades
I think so, because a) we chose to be teachers and b) it is a profession
Grades don't matter at all. They only lie about learning.
yes ... Many idiots ... We call them politicians
A great idea though many parents aren't home on both ends of the spectrum. Some travel a lot and some work two jobs.
I have never known anyone with a white collar, salary job who completes everything in 40 hours. Hourly jobs maybe.
Exactly! Benchmarks to show progress and opportunities for feedback?
Fangirling HARD! I'm off the wait list for at Dawson Co-op. Can. Not. Wait. For all her greatness!
and a checkmark does not provide a lot of feedback.
… I would give a definite yes … compliance is restrictive of … future possibilities
I think we've told ourselves that getting an entire class to complete hw is a validation of us as teachers & our teaching.Not true.
absolutely, and some content does need extra time too. I understand that.
No, but they are evidence of bad teaching
if you didn't "respond" to practice let me find a better way to ask!
If grades really mattered... there'd be many more requests for transcripts.
does it matter that they learn when they don't consider it learning? We label, they don't need to.
which gets back to the zero. It's a Huge F. Is that meaningful feedback? I've changed my view.
I'm fine with responsible, but you can't teach responsibility with grades
Taking off pints to punish kids for lack of compliance waters down communication about mastery achievement.
Yes, because child can be caught between tch and parent. Not a great place to be.
That depends on Ss and where they are and what they need. Should be meaningful and necessary. Might be none.
As a somewhat busy parent, I wouldn't take kindly to a teacher dictating my time with my kids.
Compliance serves algorithmic tasks, it is rarely fodder for innovation.
Given: Grades are not providing incentives for all S's. T's need to find a new approach. Who is this kid? What is his passion?
agreed. I'm in a diff situation; kiddo has a 504 for ADHD. But teachers have to be receptive to parent feedback.
Too many teachers would grades and points like weapons to force students into compliance. This is NOT about learning. It's control
. bc it requires admitting that something we were (probably) good at may not have been affirmation of our own learning
I'm not sure I know what that means, but I think I like it.
I wouldn't say lie. Tell partial tales?
Bad teaching or INEFFECTIVE teaching. There is a difference.
If grades matter, who on this would like to have GPA tattooed on forehead?
You don't teach anything with grades. For some Ss, grades are meaningless. But, for many, they do motivate.
process, knowledge recognition & schema building, self assess via content as portal for critical & moral thinking.
The value we put on feedback is a function of a number of different factors: on topic, effort, competence, analytic skill
an interesting activity for Ts is to analyze the gradebook- does an F mean a child knows very little or just quit working
I want to know more!Grades lie about learning?Intriguing.What are they lying about?To?
Starr sums it all up beautifully in Hacking Assessment https://t.co/bKyEOaeIF5 https://t.co/AuMWzj87QD
Too many teachers would grades and points like weapons to force students into compliance. This is NOT about learning. It's control
haha. HW for me as an S was not my after school focus. Work/sports was
Definitely. There has to be follow-up and problem solving...can't be zero and forget it.
some would argue that compliance is a very important skill to be 'successful'
Grades and workbooks destroy creativity and higher order thinking.Park grades and built portfolios
GPA is important though for college scholarships and admission
I like zeros on a cheque payable to me!!! :-) Haha!
A Recovering Perfectionist's Journey To Give Up Grades | Starr Sackstein | TEDxYouth@BHS - YouTube https://t.co/ipi7nbxNpj
How does a grade motivate? My kids are 4.0 students and say they hate their work and don't care about it
.REALLY interested in starting a school garden, any suggestions on how to begin?
and kids don't learn that without us?
Compliance prepares Ss to be worker bees in jobs that have repetitive tasks.
if a parent contacts a T to tell them the kid couldn't finish, that has to be accepted and understood. Student shouldn't feel guilty
Reconsidering End of Year Grading for Student Mastery - Work in Progress - Education Week Teacher https://t.co/UVC48rZqPM
and they'll remember the grade longer than the content they were assessed on
sort of... one of a bunch of factors...
Many Ts believe in homework as indicative of other humanistic qualities. Also an easy way to "show" data
yup, tow the line, do the time, don't get out of line.
Comments provide reinforcement or suggestions for strengthening "rock". HOWEVER, feedback is timeconsuming
I'd argue it stifles innovation. Following directions is one thing but need to question purpose
Grades & feedback are not just a binary 1 or 0. It is evaluating interaction between teacher, student and content.
No, the Ss should get a 100 bc he demonstrated mastery.
Do you already have tools? Shovels, rakes, pick axe for tougher spots, gloves? Make signs and ask for S volunteers?
Compliant learners are not usually engaged learners
I agree. My geeky ways found grades very motivating back in the day...
. If we don't use grades then how will we arbitrarily sort and rank kids? ;)
Love rubrics w/o a numerical value. Began using 10+ yrs ago. Detailed rubrics give Ss and Ps clear feedback
that machines will do in 10 years
it's bad data. We can create what we want to see easily but doesn't actually prove learning
maybe, but often innovation (iteration ;) comes from artificial walls.
I would say that comments are feedback, but they are not necessarily evaluative.
some of my ss can demonstrate such w writing. Others only orally. Missing work informs little
i have my students line up alphabetically by height. That seems to work well ;)
This is one of the major reasons I let go of grades. Score means nothing out of context https://t.co/13RMseM4TM
and they'll remember the grade longer than the content they were assessed on
Syracuse U Invests $9 Million in Summer Updates to Classrooms, Campus: Classrooms at Syracuse Univers... https://t.co/r27q44XUcq
Then, obviously, they are motivated by the grade and not the quality assignments.
it is also interesting to compare HW grades and assessment grades- that was quite eye opening for me
Now this is an like the good old days!
You know that, he knows that, I know that, but the masses...
We need more quality assignments, not less accountability.
I don't want Ss asking "how can I get an A?" I want them asking "how can I elaborate more on my evidence?" HW doesn't do that
Yes, now it is time for our school system and province to throw away standardized tests.
If we need grades to get kids to do the assigned work, then we are asking our kids to do the wrong kind of work...
Yes!!!! https://t.co/FputjTGGnt
Grades and workbooks destroy creativity and higher order thinking.Park grades and built portfolios
Pizza is always real Mark. Even when it's just ingredients. Don't mess with pizza brother :)
imagine how important grades will be when college is free :)
I agree. Critical thinking/prob solve curriculum REQUIRE more than 40. How do we compensate tchrs?
I feel I must be missing the main action somehow. Where is it at?
That's a good point. Adapting one's rubric goes hand in glove with dynamic teaching. Key is to get engagement.
I suppose but I guess we'd have to discuss what it means to be successful
Many still do-when giving scholarship money (2 kids in college)
I feel like there is an echo in here. Hi Starr!
I'm getting progressively "louder" about this issue
Yes!! Great challenge for sure. Maybe the issue isn't the 0 but complex student need and the system needs?
We have to convince the masses.
Nothing gets me angrier than a teacher telling kids they're taking points off for anything...
yup, stuff like that is really interesting to me (but not usually to anyone else ;)
I was scared to eliminate hw bc of pacing guides.Haven't noticed a difference and it's been 3 yrs. Used instruct. time more wisely
the DIBELS has San option in beta right now
Yes. Me too. I loved playing the game b/c I was good at it.
I think Ss should earn A by mastery or effort. That's the real world. Sometimes, u are really good. Sometimes, u work really hard.
Whether college is free or not, some work is quality while other work is not.
According to my research, most care more about test scores.
Grades don't promote growth feedback and shared outcomes do more for meaning and purpose. S's need to feel/know what's in it for me?
You have to decide that for yourself. :) I ask for 10 minutes a day, mainly reflection time.
You have to decide that for yourself. :) I ask for 10 minutes a day, mainly reflection time.
combination of GPA and ACT/SAT for my kids
to me. I'm interested. I was compliant for a long time. When I started breaking rules I surpassed success
Summer Assignment: Write a philosophy statement EACH for , to include in a syllabus.
I don't think convince is right word, teach , perhaps
THANK YOU for participating in What fun we had while learning lots…
Rather than a 0 maybe a real conversation on why didn't you do this? May lead to why do I need to do this. Make work meaningful !
This sounds excellent. Have you blogged about it? Would love to learn more!
For better retention of your content,work on improving your Ss' working memory.Read this::MT https://t.co/vAgtDpfPTR
too much curriculum to cover? ;)
We have to do more than just talk about eliminating grades; we must act. https://t.co/1mV6xQ1JoK is where action happens. Join us.
15-minute breaks every 2 hours end up being more productive
15-minute breaks every 2 hours end up being more productive
lateness, missing work, neatness etc. these have nothing to do with learning
but again, we determine whether hw is part of that equation.
Lucky! My mom decided to give me chores when I was too quiet. Made it hard to get hw done until I got a later bedtime
When asked at the end of the year, 100% of my Ss said that they felt fair grades should reflect effort and not mastery.
define quality :) These are the real discussions masked by the requirement of grading.
shaking my head vigorously
it depends: some hard projects kids breeze thru: others lag
I'd like my peers to approach observations and learning like that
wow. Bad tweet. DIBELS researchers have developed a math progress monitoring tool. It's in beta right now.
System can work if tchr is comfortable with ; sharing power and control.
I've been entertaining the idea of starting a blog . Presenting on this at :)
but no homework really: too many kids have responsibilities at my school -no free time
Agree about meaning & purpose. Start with engagement. Genuine communication and feedback makes learning meaningful
and I don't want them to judge my off hours either lol
Trust and respect of peers through shared is paramount in transformative classrooms. https://t.co/743286zW6A
A Big Shift - we are moving from vertical trust in experts and people with authority to horizontal trust in peers https://t.co/l3f8jnk10A
Nothing tops of an like a Bruce Lee quote.
Missing work does. If they don't complete the work, they can't learn. Or the assignment was useless.
I am not sure behavior & HMWK completion belong as part of an academic grade reflecting mastery. Unfortunately, I did it as a tchr.
I feel that it comes from the conversations and post ob reflections with supervisor. Ss need that as well.
following directions is a skill but they have be purposeful. can teach this skill without penalty but rather w transparency
they don't. We all did, but there is time to change!
some kids take longer to learn than our predetermined deadline
& they shouldnt. A practice done badly is not a mark against the practice, but the practitioner.
To define quality is million dollar challenge. Grades do force some quantitative assessment.
agree on engagement-when passion and interest is sparked the learner is motivated key to meaningful work & life
Getting rid of grades is not a magic wand. Focus on good teaching and quality feedback.
how many kids are engaged in learning activities & how many go home to 'take a brain break'?
yes but... There's more to it. Can't just a be following directions or deadlines - it's learning
Yes and now offers powerful filtering tools to separate activities.
when an S doesn't do hw, the T says "you didn't do it. You get a 0," not "but you didn't get an extra chance to practice that skill"
not saying it is required, but why is HW only for kids in sch? What if we designed activities whole family can do?
shouldn't be graded. Time management should be practiced and mastered
It can, but admin need to have that mindset, too, we're all Ss and learners
never completing work usually relates to deeper problems or issues
What kind of work should we be asking them to do?
need to address core issues creating problem and not penalize for it
we need to look at scores as a roadmap to the destination, NOT the destination itself.
NO PANACEA for teach prob-solving curriculum. Workbks can reinforce concepts for some; trial/error projects for others
Right. Their problem. They can deal with it.
Too scared to fail? Make a growth mindset the reality for the sake of LEARNING. Ss & Ts benefit. https://t.co/XGNYCMgbuh
Great question. Evaluation is a critical part of what the teacher or mentor offers the students.
but there is a purpose for why yours has to be in at a certain time. Much of what we ask kids to do is sadly arbitrary
Well, yes, it is a lifelong journey
Keep telling yourself that, and one day you might believe it.
need to differentiate everything for all kids
agreed and what if we got zeros rather than feedback and support from other teachers and admins?
Not certain evaluation is the goal. Internal motivation is key. What does THAT journey entail?
comments rooted in the learning objective/rubric are evaluative though.
thanks for watching. It's time to change assessment - communication of mastery and treat it delicately
more learning occurs in school than domain content. A good MS curriculum challenges Ss to think multiplistically
Boom, that, right there! Bottle it!
Missing skills or understanding? Some students won't ask questions, no matter what!
effort shouldn't be graded though. Need to assess actual learning growth
yes. Too much of it is just about compliance and control and not about learning
especially if you're stuck grading homework ;)
If they encourage Ss to self-reflect , self-improve they can be summative. Evaluation =final
Perhaps the journey is to become a lifelong learner, critical thinker & overall educated person.
there needs to be a buy in &expectation with real consequence but the grade shouldn't be the penalty. Needs to matter more
If good teaching is happening, effort and growth will be one and the same.
I find they will. We need to teach them how to self advocate. Reflect
Yes I agree with this https://t.co/k3wBaz597I
We shouldn't impose our "neatness," we should encourage intentional decision making in all aspects, S choice first.
How might we replace flickering censure in this uncertain time?
Nothing motivates better than real success. So Ss need a personal learning goal, a doable plan & mentor
Assessing them against themselves. Providing the upfront.
Thanks to all who participated in today's Thanks to to for moderating our session.
I agree with everything you say. At the end of the day, grades in my class are universally high b/c of doing all this.
I like the IBs approach to grading: start with 0 and earn pts with evidence.
When Ss see they earned a 60%, they have to understand that score reflects level of mastery, not just # of problems missed.
I had someone ask me what meta-cognition was. College educated. He wanted to know if that was some type of teacher speak
also the realization that our subject is just one of many kids are forced to learn and they may not love it.
However, I think many people need grades/pay check...other extrinsic motivators for better or worse.
maybe it's because they don't know anything else. It's a mindset shift
STUCK grading homework? Think how the student feels DOING the HW? ?
I suspect that if school work was tied to getting (or not getting) lunch students would have more incentive to work.
Student Voice Should Determine Progress Report Grades - Work in Progress - Education Week Teacher https://t.co/mygjHvPnDO
That, of course, would be wrong but pretty effective. Coercion is easy, we need to think about that in school.
Some enviro, by virtue of discrimination R void of robust ops to dev CT & soc justice know, spec argumentation.
Remember, working together doesn’t make it collaboration. Anybody can be in a group and not with the group.
Saw the 1st back to school displays at Target, what are you working on for your classroom? What tools/resources do you need?
thanks. There are ways around them until the very end
Job incentives? It's called the with correct spelling of your name and correct decimal pt. LOL
Grades aren't the problem, it is the perception of grades as a weapon or as a true indicator of knowledge.
The problem with grades is student perception that grades are final judgement of who they are...
I'm receptive to my post-ob scores bc of the convo around the score. Ss often don't get to have that convo bc of time constraints
News is everywhere 24/7. Lessons in research/thinking for self are necessary teachings. https://t.co/nEJWrpCs72
Reflecting on fact that I now learn about big news by noticing an engaging . What's the EDU lesson to take from this?
I'm wondering how do you monitor/track ss blogs for genius hour? With 150 ss, I'm needing an organized method/approach.
Students will often prioritize the assignment that gives the biggest time+points reward Grades are the school's/kids/Ps economy
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if a zero is given, should additional time be given to relearn and demo understand of the missed concept
It is all about mindset! One big shift is Ss need to stop seeing grades as a learning endpoint
Grades should be a marker in the learning process. A checkpoint.
Update 15 Tech Tool Favorites From ISTE 2016 - A Google certified educator and ed-tech trainer shares s... https://t.co/AjUo8oTQCc
we live in a society that places relative value on everything. Grades are the Ed system's iteration of this.
When an is still generating discussion 30 minutes after it ends, that is what I call successful.
That should be the ultimate goal but unfortunately grades often get in the way as students see them as an end point.
