#ASEchat Archive

The Association for Science Education (ASE) promotes excellence in science teaching and learning. Follow #ASEchat Mondays at 3pm ET.
Monday June 5, 2017
3:00 PM EDT
  • participatechat Jun 5 @ 3:00 PM EDT
    Participate in the upcoming #ASEchat by sharing resources and collaborating at https://t.co/mKOeusFf0N
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:01 PM EDT
    And we are off with #asechat, keep it clean, no adverts please, lest start with @doc_kristy ’s Q What's science techr professional learning?
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:02 PM EDT
    Learning how to teach science?#ASEChat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:03 PM EDT
    Is it learning that helps you to do your ‘job’ better? Should we all be committed to continual improvement? #ASEChat
    In reply to @doc_kristy
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:03 PM EDT
    #ASEChat
    • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:02 PM EDT
      Is professional learning managed differently in England, Scotland, NI and Wales? # asechat
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:03 PM EDT
    oops thanks for the #asechat correction
    In reply to @ViciaScience
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:04 PM EDT
    #asechat - I'd like to advertise my new cleaning product? No?
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:04 PM EDT
    No (That is all) #ASEChat
    In reply to @A_Weatherall, @doc_kristy
  • Rendcombbiology Jun 5 @ 3:05 PM EDT
    #ASEchat Being back in academia has definitely made me more reflective in the classroom even though my MEd is leadership focussed.
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:05 PM EDT
    Standard for teacher’s PD published by @educationgovuk https://t.co/KqohmM1RCc (England) #ASEChat is it relevant to you?
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:06 PM EDT
    So can 'reflective practice' be labelled 'professional learning' or is an external source needed? #asechat
    In reply to @Rendcombbiology, @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:07 PM EDT
    Hi Natalie Is it because you have more time to ‘think’ ? Can you learn professionally without engaging in Ed research? #ASEChat
    In reply to @Rendcombbiology, @doc_kristy
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:08 PM EDT
    Is it only professional if a peer/organisation is confirming your 'learning'? #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @Rendcombbiology, @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • Rendcombbiology Jun 5 @ 3:09 PM EDT
    Absolutely the time has been a big factor (9 days residential this year) but also the external deadlines have helped me focus #ASEChat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:09 PM EDT
    Teacher professional Learning Journey (Northern Ireland) https://t.co/Ti6kWWNxDC #asechat does this work in NI?
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:09 PM EDT
    Engaging in ed research reveals multiple approaches possible, whereas an individual teacher may initially only consider 'one way' #asechat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @Rendcombbiology, @doc_kristy
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:09 PM EDT
    That's an interesting question #asechat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam, @ViciaScience, @Rendcombbiology, @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:09 PM EDT
    Hi all, managed to join tonight. Feels like an age. A Q: Is professional learning different to professional development? #asechat
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:09 PM EDT
    Just thinking those exact words! #asechat
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:10 PM EDT
    Peer review is an important aspect of professional learning - but not necessarily by a formal organisation ? #asechat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam, @Rendcombbiology, @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • Rendcombbiology Jun 5 @ 3:11 PM EDT
    I think is could be done internally but only if the school fosters the culture of development not judgement CPD #ASEChat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:11 PM EDT
    To which the answer many people want to hear (no) is possibly different to the correct answer (yes?) #asechat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:11 PM EDT
    I wonder if the answer is in here? One of my favourite books on developing a teaching profession #asechat @MarcNeesam
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:12 PM EDT
    possibly confirming what they hoped to find out? based on observations of their own students learning? #ASEChat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @Rendcombbiology, @doc_kristy
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:13 PM EDT
    Saw this tweet today and it may be relevant https://t.co/omxXsYEF8t #asechat
    • informed_edu Jun 5 @ 3:36 AM EDT
      Saying a conference is "great CPD" is like saying a trip to Tesco is a "great meal". It's what you do with what you bring back that counts.
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:14 PM EDT
    I really should have a good answer to this! Finding out more about how to make students' experiences and therefore outcomes better. #asechat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • stormeducation Jun 5 @ 3:14 PM EDT
    I'm multi-tasking #asechat AND #primaryrocks tonight
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:14 PM EDT
    Thanks for asking this! I was going to ask the same thing. I need someone to tell me what professional learning it! (sorry...) #ASEChat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:15 PM EDT
    brilliant well done Peter, looking forward to some cross tweeting between chats #asechat #PrimaryRocks
    In reply to @stormeducation
  • BiochemSoc Jun 5 @ 3:15 PM EDT
    Find out more about #STEMinsight opportunities for #teachers with these fab case studies from @StemLearning #ASEchat https://t.co/rPBt6Icb5x
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:15 PM EDT
    #asechat I think that it's difficult to implement things from a conference. CPD is better for me when spread over time.
    In reply to @MarcNeesam
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:15 PM EDT
    Professional learning/development is dependent on the individual and the direction they want their career or teaching to move? #asechat
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:16 PM EDT
    #asechat sorry I'm late...
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:16 PM EDT
    #asechat
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:16 PM EDT
    Learning more effective if a social enterprise, but this is not essential for learning to occur. #asechat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam, @Rendcombbiology, @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:17 PM EDT
    Yes, I'd agree with this. Unless given time and space to do so. #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:17 PM EDT
    They're the sane. It's just that professional learning sounds like it encompasses more. IMHO. #asechat
    In reply to @chemDrK, @MarcNeesam
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:17 PM EDT
    Should we have more structure to the professional learning journey? #asechat is the Scottish model working? https://t.co/F7jde5vnEY
    • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:15 PM EDT
      Professional learning/development is dependent on the individual and the direction they want their career or teaching to move? #asechat
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:17 PM EDT
    But to be 'professional' then interaction with others is a requirement. 'Others' does not imply of different status #asechat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam, @Rendcombbiology, @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:18 PM EDT
    So is learning professional when I, as a professional, do it and value it independently of external validation? #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @Rendcombbiology, @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:18 PM EDT
    Interesting. I've not really heard people refer to it as professional learning. #ASEchat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:18 PM EDT
    This link has a definition of PL at the top of the page. Scottish model Any science teaching Scots out there #asechat does it work?
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:18 PM EDT
    You can learn professionally without accreditation or validation. #asechat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam, @ViciaScience, @Rendcombbiology, @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:19 PM EDT
    #asechat how about the community of practice model?
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:19 PM EDT
    Came across it first a few years ago. Academics at the ASE summer conference were using it. #asechat
    In reply to @chemDrK, @MarcNeesam
  • Rendcombbiology Jun 5 @ 3:19 PM EDT
    Not sure about the scottish model but Yes to more structure! #ASEChat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:19 PM EDT
    #asechat https://t.co/SBBgbmGIqI should have been on there - twitterfall is not behaving.
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:19 PM EDT
    Initially I would not expect teachers to have a clear understanding of their own students learning. Hard to achieve this #asechat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @Rendcombbiology, @doc_kristy
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:20 PM EDT
    #asechat Are we making assuming that teacher professional learning should be focused on student/learning 'outcomes'? What about management?
    In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • OLewis_coaching Jun 5 @ 3:21 PM EDT
    Research improves outcomes for Ss & self, development & choosing right CPD, being evidence informed, reading around subject #ASEchat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:21 PM EDT
    'Development' implies you have to improve as a result of something you are taught, but 'learning' could me you don't do anything #asechat
    In reply to @chemDrK, @MarcNeesam
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:21 PM EDT
    'Professional' - noun or adjective? #asechat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam, @Rendcombbiology, @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:21 PM EDT
    Seems to be a bit of structure here in Wales https://t.co/1cy7r4jtXX but cant find any recent refs is it working? Welsh teachers? #asechat
    • Rendcombbiology Jun 5 @ 3:19 PM EDT
      Not sure about the scottish model but Yes to more structure! #ASEChat
      In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:22 PM EDT
    *could MEAN you don't do anything... as you learn that something doesn't actually have an effect. #asechat
    In reply to @chemDrK, @MarcNeesam
  • MrsHugginsClass Jun 5 @ 3:22 PM EDT
    Sorry I am late, this is my first live chat... can't wait to learn from you all! #ASECHAT
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:22 PM EDT
    Yes! And as I said at the time, several twitter conversations recently (one on circuits) have shown great CPD basis. #asechat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:22 PM EDT
    hmmmm... that's an interesting perspective. So do it just for interest? Not to improve at something necessarily? #ASEchat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:22 PM EDT
    ah!! right that makes more sense!! :-) yes. Get you! :-) #ASEChat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:23 PM EDT
    Sounds like presentation - eg formative assessment vs responsive teaching. If you learn without developing is it a waste of effort? #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @chemDrK
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:23 PM EDT
    What did you do to bring about that learning? Cant really be ‘nothing’ #ASEChat
    • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:22 PM EDT
      *could MEAN you don't do anything... as you learn that something doesn't actually have an effect. #asechat
      In reply to @chemDrK, @MarcNeesam
  • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:23 PM EDT
    Indeed but collaborative learning situated in context with appropriate external expertise and challenge likely to be effective PL #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @MarcNeesam, @Rendcombbiology, @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:24 PM EDT
    So is the Scottish model of ‘accreditation’ bringing about greater PL? or is it box ticking? (You don’t have to answer that Stuart) #ASEChat
    • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:23 PM EDT
      Indeed but collaborative learning situated in context with appropriate external expertise and challenge likely to be effective PL #asechat
      In reply to @ViciaScience, @MarcNeesam, @Rendcombbiology, @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:25 PM EDT
    Time, space, support, resource as well as opportunity to reflect, embed, evaluate, tweak etc #asechat
    In reply to @A_Weatherall, @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • essex_rob Jun 5 @ 3:25 PM EDT
    #asechat I did CPD today: on targeting levels 1-3. One idea: to improve my teaching of non-specialist language, e.g "explain", "describe".
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:25 PM EDT
    Welcome! WE are talking about professional learning (and it would be good to move it to a science context soon) #ASEChat
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:25 PM EDT
    I have a feeling this #asechat could get quite philosophical!
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:25 PM EDT
    I think that is where we need to be careful. Teachers can think something we're doing differently has to have an impact #asechat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam, @chemDrK
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:26 PM EDT
    Do we try to fit in too much? With a full timetable there isn't the luxury of all of the above #asechat
    In reply to @stuartphysics, @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:26 PM EDT
    #asechat personally i'd like to see more teachers reflecting on "what i changed" "why I changed it" (link to info) and "effect". fast cycle.
  • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:27 PM EDT
    Not implemented fully, still need to change culture so that PL is properly appreciated and supported #asechat Slowly moving in right direc'n
    In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:27 PM EDT
    But in fact it was the enthusiasm for the change that made it seem it was effective. #asechat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam, @chemDrK
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:27 PM EDT
    #asechat so where do we get ideas of things we might change in our practice? "Off Twitter" is too vague!
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:27 PM EDT
    get your point. But actually... by learning *not* to do something, or that something's worth stopping.. isn't that "development"? #ASEchat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:27 PM EDT
    Agree. May be other conditions needed too, e.g. support for risk taking #asechat
    • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:23 PM EDT
      Indeed but collaborative learning situated in context with appropriate external expertise and challenge likely to be effective PL #asechat
      In reply to @ViciaScience, @MarcNeesam, @Rendcombbiology, @NeedhamL56, @doc_kristy
  • Rendcombbiology Jun 5 @ 3:27 PM EDT
    Time is a major factor which is where an external qualification / course can help to make time.#asechat
    In reply to @A_Weatherall, @stuartphysics, @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:27 PM EDT
    I want to say Hawthorne Effect but I might be confused... #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:28 PM EDT
    IS it true that you have to keep your CPD record unto date to continue as a teacher in Scotland? #ASEChat
    In reply to @stuartphysics
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:28 PM EDT
    Yes! I think this is a real danger!Same with 1day events like CPD/ conferences. You come away all inspired and fired up. Feels good #ASEchat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:28 PM EDT
    In all careers professional learning/development is to meet a purpose/have an impact. Teaching shouldn't be any different. #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @chemDrK
  • Rendcombbiology Jun 5 @ 3:29 PM EDT
    Often SLT can be focussed on short term gains of outcomes to allow risk taking. Culture has to be right first #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:29 PM EDT
    Excellent observation Helen, (unconscious bias) #ASEChat Social science research a tricky area for us scientists
    • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:27 PM EDT
      But in fact it was the enthusiasm for the change that made it seem it was effective. #asechat
      In reply to @MarcNeesam, @chemDrK
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:29 PM EDT
    ...but to make a difference it needs to be a long-term thing.Well longer than a day(or the immediate aftermath/ after-glow, anyway) #ASEchat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:29 PM EDT
    Will you implement it next week? #ASEchat
    In reply to @essex_rob
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:29 PM EDT
    Professional learning is to move you forward in your role/career, personal learning is because you're interested. #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @chemDrK
  • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:29 PM EDT
    Yes, needs to be 'signed off' by line manager every 5 years (Prof Update). Only as good as professionalism of teacher and line mgr #asechat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:30 PM EDT
    what about learning for pleasure? ;-) I'm not actually being facetious. What about impact on retention/ satisfaction, for example? #ASEchat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam, @hrogerson
  • stormeducation Jun 5 @ 3:30 PM EDT
    #asechat, #primaryrocks is getting more tweet activity
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:31 PM EDT
    Also you may be lucky enough to find professional learning personally interesting and fulfilling. Is that more likely in teaching? #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @chemDrK
  • SKLchem Jun 5 @ 3:31 PM EDT
    #asechat Sometimes tho' you need the spark to trigger further investigation - maybe reading about an idea that you can then trial ....
    In reply to @chemDrK, @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:31 PM EDT
    That purpose could be filling a perceived gap in practice #asechat could be SKE and/or PCK
    • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:28 PM EDT
      In all careers professional learning/development is to meet a purpose/have an impact. Teaching shouldn't be any different. #asechat
      In reply to @hrogerson, @chemDrK
  • doc_kristy Jun 5 @ 3:31 PM EDT
    OK, just back from Zumba... Summary so far.. We can't decide what professional learning is but we're all doing it, yes!? 😉. #asechat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:31 PM EDT
    Or is learning something that you need to do to develop professionally? Does Prof dev imply 'attainment' #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @chemDrK, @MarcNeesam
  • MrsHugginsClass Jun 5 @ 3:31 PM EDT
    I would agree with this! Sometimes not doing something that wasn't working can be more beneficial. #asechat
    In reply to @chemDrK, @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:32 PM EDT
    This is where I fall down. When I try something out, how do I know it is working? #asechat
    • SKLchem Jun 5 @ 3:31 PM EDT
      #asechat Sometimes tho' you need the spark to trigger further investigation - maybe reading about an idea that you can then trial ....
      In reply to @chemDrK, @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • Rendcombbiology Jun 5 @ 3:32 PM EDT
    That's so important. Also being able to model growth mindset and resilience to your pupils by challenging yourself with PL #asechat
    In reply to @chemDrK, @MarcNeesam, @hrogerson
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:32 PM EDT
    Ah yes. Get the distinction. It's taken me a while tonight...! Sorry about the semantics. Think you're right. #ASEchat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam, @hrogerson
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:33 PM EDT
    Interesting, so some teachers will get really good support for their learning, and others will be experiencing box ticking #asechat
    • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:29 PM EDT
      Yes, needs to be 'signed off' by line manager every 5 years (Prof Update). Only as good as professionalism of teacher and line mgr #asechat
      In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:33 PM EDT
    #asechat
    • adamboxer1 Jun 5 @ 3:32 PM EDT
      It's called CPL at my school. No different to CPD anywhere else.
      In reply to @chemDrK, @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:33 PM EDT
    Yes, support for risk taking, lack of blame, trust all important #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:33 PM EDT
    learning for pleasure is up to you :) A good employer will try to develop you to meet your needs/wants but employer comes first #asechat
    In reply to @chemDrK, @hrogerson
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:33 PM EDT
    #asechat maybe the very fact that, in England, no agreed format for reporting means our opinions on it are so varied?
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:33 PM EDT
    possibly (or not) #ASEChat
    • doc_kristy Jun 5 @ 3:31 PM EDT
      OK, just back from Zumba... Summary so far.. We can't decide what professional learning is but we're all doing it, yes!? 😉. #asechat
      In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:34 PM EDT
    Good point! Yes- so.. it might be about what you do with it afterwards. But yes: the actual "PD" bit might just be a one-off event. #ASEchat
    In reply to @SKLchem, @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:34 PM EDT
    #asechat is it worth pointing out that even if you decide not to pursue accredited status, the guides are really useful? #CSciTeach #CPhys
  • SKLchem Jun 5 @ 3:34 PM EDT
    #asechat Surely that depends on what it is. Outcomes such as grade improvements; engagement; uptake of option; increased confidence,
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • Rendcombbiology Jun 5 @ 3:35 PM EDT
    What if they want curious professional who embody growth mindset and life long learners #asechat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam, @chemDrK, @hrogerson
  • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:35 PM EDT
    Basically placebo effect - why Hattie sets 0.4 effect size as expectation for any intervention #asechat
    In reply to @teachingofsci, @hrogerson
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:35 PM EDT
    Reminds me when we discussed Independent Projects at #aseconf. #asechat
    In reply to @doc_kristy, @NeedhamL56
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:36 PM EDT
    But it could be one and the same… Bonus learning ;) #ASEChat
    In reply to @chemDrK, @MarcNeesam, @hrogerson
  • MrsHugginsClass Jun 5 @ 3:36 PM EDT
    I think it depends on what you are trying! #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:36 PM EDT
    yep... hence the P being "professional" rather than "personal", I guess... #ASEchat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam, @hrogerson
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:36 PM EDT
    agree! :-) #ASEchat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @MarcNeesam, @hrogerson
  • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:37 PM EDT
    Balance between inspirational triggers & ongoing implementation and follow-up important. Need long term impact. Not often achieved #asechat
    In reply to @chemDrK, @hrogerson, @MarcNeesam
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:37 PM EDT
    #asechat to repeat, where might we go for guides to changes - not just ideas, but the underpinning theory eg misconceptions?
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:37 PM EDT
    Good if the employer's idea of professional development matches what you want - which could include growth mindset etc etc #asechat
    In reply to @Rendcombbiology, @chemDrK, @hrogerson
  • fiddleBrain Jun 5 @ 3:38 PM EDT
    Hello #ASEChat from Orkney! Curious from persp. of how #scicomm-er/scientists can support STEM teacher learning...when we know what that is😉
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:38 PM EDT
    #asechat hope it doesn't count as an advert, but I've found the diagnostic Qs approach from @maryUYSEG and team v useful to guide change
  • MrsHugginsClass Jun 5 @ 3:39 PM EDT
    I wonder though shouldn't the "P" represent both, if we are not excited about the idea/learning, will we actually develop? #asechat
    In reply to @chemDrK, @MarcNeesam, @hrogerson
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:39 PM EDT
    A lot of this comes down to a persons or employers culture towards professional development #asechat
    In reply to @stuartphysics, @chemDrK, @hrogerson
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:39 PM EDT
    same :-) #ASEChat
    In reply to @teachingofsci, @MaryUYSEG
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:40 PM EDT
    I think I find professional learning more difficult than I should because resources to use in class can be few and far between. #asechat
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:40 PM EDT
    I'm really hoping someone asnwers this. I need to know! :-) I have a feeling the answer might be "42" or something.... :-S #ASEchat
    In reply to @teachingofsci
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:40 PM EDT
    Could make that argument for any job/career. Ideally yes, but not always possible. e.g. learning how to understand data etc #asechat
    In reply to @MrsHugginsClass, @chemDrK, @hrogerson
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:40 PM EDT
    Other 'professionals' - those who have built up a store of professional wisdom! #asechat
    • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:37 PM EDT
      #asechat to repeat, where might we go for guides to changes - not just ideas, but the underpinning theory eg misconceptions?
  • MrsDrSarah Jun 5 @ 3:41 PM EDT
    #asechat Is professional learning/dev just about pedagogy? Feels tricky when whole school 'CPD' very broad - sometimes hard to apply.
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:41 PM EDT
    and process of considering better Qs, + what kids' answers tell me, has led to my own professional learning. embedded in practice. #asechat
    In reply to @chemDrK, @MaryUYSEG
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:41 PM EDT
    Hi to Orkney,think this PL would be linked to Subject Knowledge, often this is squeezed in English model, focus on generic Pedagogy #asechat
  • SKLchem Jun 5 @ 3:41 PM EDT
    #asechat Absolutely agree - after ASE Northern conference https://t.co/BKjEJmD5Kq - find it hard to write these ques - did AfL online course
    In reply to @teachingofsci, @hrogerson, @MaryUYSEG
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:41 PM EDT
    #ASEChat this is the gap I am trying to fill to support colleagues if I could.
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:42 PM EDT
    Oh god! Yes.Can remember a stats course I did once (in my previous career......) zzzz (sorry!) that was definitely professional ;-) #ASEchat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam, @MrsHugginsClass, @hrogerson
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:42 PM EDT
    I remember @informed_edu blogging about this last year as well - https://t.co/7C2rTEVKpu #asechat
    In reply to @stuartphysics, @chemDrK, @hrogerson, @informed_edu
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:42 PM EDT
    Yes, the resources suggested at CPD events, while usually inspiring, are often few steps removed to the teaching/curric reqs #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:42 PM EDT
    Absolutely not, ID of gaps in both SKE and PCK, take on learning to fill the gaps, more important for science ? #ASEChat
    • MrsDrSarah Jun 5 @ 3:41 PM EDT
      #asechat Is professional learning/dev just about pedagogy? Feels tricky when whole school 'CPD' very broad - sometimes hard to apply.
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:42 PM EDT
    ideally, valuable as that is, we need something more systematic. Obviously I'm thinking of @physicsnews resources. #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @PhysicsNews
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:42 PM EDT
    Ideas, activities and resources were things that were real positives about the way the national strategies were delivered. #ASEchat
  • SKLchem Jun 5 @ 3:43 PM EDT
    #asechat benefit of time in dept as part of whole day cpd to discuss how to apply to subject area
    In reply to @A_Weatherall, @hrogerson
  • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:43 PM EDT
    Think most whole school CPD fails to meet needs. Effective CPD dependent on context and often limited transfer between domains #asechat
    In reply to @MrsDrSarah
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:44 PM EDT
    Should the learning and support be about developing their own resources? (Teach a man to fish) #ASEChat
    • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:41 PM EDT
      #ASEChat this is the gap I am trying to fill to support colleagues if I could.
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:44 PM EDT
    To be honest I have never found department discussion in this area doing anything but go round in circles. #asechat
    In reply to @SKLchem, @A_Weatherall
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:44 PM EDT
    Work with teachers / organisations to create resources for classroom use. Tchr improves subject knowledge, scicommer benefits too #asechat
    In reply to @fiddleBrain
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:44 PM EDT
    I would hope it isn't. Pedagogy is only one part of being a teacher (and potential school leader) #asechat
    In reply to @MrsDrSarah
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:44 PM EDT
    If you want practice to change then you have to supply teaching resources. #ASEChat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:45 PM EDT
    Pedagogical Content Knowledge (Knowing how to teach your subject, rather than just teach) #ASEChat
    In reply to @MrsDrSarah
  • MrsDrSarah Jun 5 @ 3:45 PM EDT
    I think this is so important - also relies on department culture of willingness/desire to apply ideas to teaching. #asechat
    In reply to @SKLchem, @A_Weatherall, @hrogerson
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:45 PM EDT
    It's difficult to commit everyone's very busy and overstretched time to CPD. Best to go it alone. If you want CPD ask or find. #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @SKLchem
  • mchsscidrm Jun 5 @ 3:45 PM EDT
    #asechat I think it's about 'collaborative reflection' with others, diff approaches will succeed or fail with diff groups at diff times.
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:46 PM EDT
    Time needed (and support) to enable that transfer #asechat (BTW Domains sounds very posh!) ;) #asechat
    • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:43 PM EDT
      Think most whole school CPD fails to meet needs. Effective CPD dependent on context and often limited transfer between domains #asechat
      In reply to @MrsDrSarah
  • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:46 PM EDT
    But did that breed compliance rather than genuine teacher agency? #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • fiddleBrain Jun 5 @ 3:46 PM EDT
    .#ASEChat It's semantics, but IMHO, prof learning is reflective practice, whereas profess. develop. involves learning from others/on courses
    In reply to @MrsDrSarah
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:47 PM EDT
    lesson study approach can be useful if time/colleagues allow; plan together, try out, report back, improve, repeat. #asechat
    In reply to @mchsscidrm
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:47 PM EDT
    yes. But agree with @teachingofsci that it's about developing thinking, too. Planning Qs for misconceptions etc Not just resources #ASEchat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @NeedhamL56, @teachingofsci
  • SKLchem Jun 5 @ 3:47 PM EDT
    #asechat Absolutely! Have shared some ideas on metacognition (part of Growth Mindset cpd) - both within & across dpts.
    In reply to @MrsDrSarah, @A_Weatherall, @hrogerson
  • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:47 PM EDT
    There needs to be good leadership and proper strategy to avoid going round in circles or just sharing ignorance #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @SKLchem, @A_Weatherall
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:47 PM EDT
    Effective CPD needs to be focussed on specific classroom issues/practice, which usually are unique to subject #ASEChat
    In reply to @stuartphysics, @MrsDrSarah
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:48 PM EDT
    I'd pedantically put the semantics the other way round :) #asechat
    In reply to @fiddleBrain, @MrsDrSarah
  • chemDrK Jun 5 @ 3:48 PM EDT
    Very very true. Seen this many times over... in a variety of contexts. Context is a key factor. #ASEchat
    In reply to @mchsscidrm
  • fiddleBrain Jun 5 @ 3:49 PM EDT
    . #ASEChat i.e. you could go to a CPD session (as it's required) without actually doing any professional learning if you don't reflect on it
    In reply to @MrsDrSarah
  • MaryUYSEG Jun 5 @ 3:49 PM EDT
    Developing resources with novice teacher-writers can be very formative if time is available for the iterative development loop. #ASEchat
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:49 PM EDT
    Absolutely. If there was a single right way to teach everything, we would not be having this discussion #asechat
    In reply to @mchsscidrm
  • mchsscidrm Jun 5 @ 3:49 PM EDT
    #ASEchat I like lesson study as a start point although we have found it good to follow up with a longer study
    In reply to @teachingofsci
  • MrsHugginsClass Jun 5 @ 3:49 PM EDT
    My team does this nearly weekly. #asechat
    In reply to @teachingofsci, @mchsscidrm
  • MrsDrSarah Jun 5 @ 3:49 PM EDT
    So is it possible to do effective whole school cpd? Or better to spend time/money in department development #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @stuartphysics
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:49 PM EDT
    How useful are people's development targets of their annual appraisal/performance review? Are they used to drive PD/PL/CPD? #asechat
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:50 PM EDT
    Need a supportive environment to take risks and allow this collaborative reflection. No blame culture #asechat
    • mchsscidrm Jun 5 @ 3:45 PM EDT
      #asechat I think it's about 'collaborative reflection' with others, diff approaches will succeed or fail with diff groups at diff times.
  • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:50 PM EDT
    Not saying impossible to do whole school CPD but most ineffective and dept basd CPD likely better, but needs structure & leadership #asechat
    In reply to @MrsDrSarah, @ViciaScience
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:51 PM EDT
    Are we now creating silos so we can have the terms professional learning, professional development, CPD sit alongside one another? #asechat
  • mchsscidrm Jun 5 @ 3:51 PM EDT
    Definitely, right culture must come first #asechat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • ViciaScience Jun 5 @ 3:51 PM EDT
    In my view, and implicit in the CPD Standard, whole school CPD is not CPD - it is a meeting #asechat
    In reply to @MrsDrSarah, @stuartphysics
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:51 PM EDT
    #asechat just realised, no suggestions of using books. Read, reflect, plan change...
  • MrsDrSarah Jun 5 @ 3:52 PM EDT
    And a focus on PD, not just a big admin meeting. #asechat
    In reply to @stuartphysics, @ViciaScience
  • mchsscidrm Jun 5 @ 3:52 PM EDT
    So do we, it's the single most important thing we do #asechat
    In reply to @MrsHugginsClass, @teachingofsci
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:52 PM EDT
    One for you @hrogerson #ASEChat
    • MaryUYSEG Jun 5 @ 3:49 PM EDT
      Developing resources with novice teacher-writers can be very formative if time is available for the iterative development loop. #ASEchat
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:52 PM EDT
    Yup :( #asechat
    In reply to @alomshaha, @hrogerson, @SKLchem
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:52 PM EDT
    and often 100 ppl in a hall being powerpointed to death isn't even a meeting, it's a lecture! #asechat #betterbyemail
    In reply to @ViciaScience
  • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:53 PM EDT
    It can be an inspirational kick but likely to be transmissive rather than collaborative and directly teacher and context focussed #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @MrsDrSarah
  • MaryUYSEG Jun 5 @ 3:53 PM EDT
    Some of our DQ resources are available on the @UYSEG website https://t.co/goqGIHKbM7 #ASEchat https://t.co/nE4QTgZsG8
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:53 PM EDT
    I'm trying to bring in a parallel approach for teacher-trainers. there are mixed opinions. #asechat
    In reply to @MrsHugginsClass, @mchsscidrm
  • mrsjmclark Jun 5 @ 3:53 PM EDT
    I definitely think it is possible!Can consider how new research/ideas can be used in your subject specifically in department time. #ASEChat
    In reply to @MrsDrSarah, @stuartphysics, @ViciaScience
  • SKLchem Jun 5 @ 3:54 PM EDT
    #asechat We are so lucky to have this! Great when this happens; we started this with CA - an expert teaching us the underlying science!
    In reply to @alomshaha, @A_Weatherall, @hrogerson
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:54 PM EDT
    How can we encourage more schools to work towards this sort of model? Lots of teachers missing out? #asechat
    • mchsscidrm Jun 5 @ 3:52 PM EDT
      So do we, it's the single most important thing we do #asechat
      In reply to @MrsHugginsClass, @teachingofsci
  • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:55 PM EDT
    Agreed, interative development loop with experienced colleagues can greatly help novices #asechat Key is prioritising collaborative working
    • MaryUYSEG Jun 5 @ 3:49 PM EDT
      Developing resources with novice teacher-writers can be very formative if time is available for the iterative development loop. #ASEchat
  • MrsHugginsClass Jun 5 @ 3:56 PM EDT
    I think development is gone at that point. IF we are not engaged, we are not learning, so its a waste almost growth wise,#asechat
    In reply to @teachingofsci, @ViciaScience
  • MarcNeesam Jun 5 @ 3:56 PM EDT
    It comes down to culture and leadership (again) I think. #asechat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:56 PM EDT
    it's opportunity cost; schools/SLT almost always feel other needs are more urgent. admin meetings>dept CPD. #asechat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • MaryUYSEG Jun 5 @ 3:57 PM EDT
    Thanks to@NeedhamL56 I try to get teachers to think about applying my session to their practice #ASEchat 1/n
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:57 PM EDT
    #asechat yes, lucky to have this in my first years of teaching
    • alomshaha Jun 5 @ 3:52 PM EDT
      Best CPD resource is a kindly, smarter, more experienced teacher in same dept (rare in Physics)
      In reply to @A_Weatherall, @hrogerson, @SKLchem
  • fiddleBrain Jun 5 @ 3:57 PM EDT
    Agreed, a fundamental part of our own process & we've learnt lots from teachers eg. better & varied questioning techniques, pacing..#ASEChat
    In reply to @ViciaScience
  • MaryUYSEG Jun 5 @ 3:57 PM EDT
    I'd really like them to bring back their DQs next week for us to discuss how they were used and how they could be improved 2/n #ASEChat
  • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:58 PM EDT
    Always #asechat
    In reply to @MarcNeesam, @NeedhamL56
  • MrsDrSarah Jun 5 @ 3:58 PM EDT
    Can I be on your team!? Love my dept, but our meetings are always admin-focused. We share PD but casually. #asechat
    In reply to @MrsHugginsClass
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:58 PM EDT
    All dependent on strong leadership (again) @educationgovuk Standard for PD emphasises this https://t.co/KqohmM1RCc #asechat @informed_edu
    • stuartphysics Jun 5 @ 3:55 PM EDT
      Agreed, interative development loop with experienced colleagues can greatly help novices #asechat Key is prioritising collaborative working
      • MaryUYSEG Jun 5 @ 3:49 PM EDT
        Developing resources with novice teacher-writers can be very formative if time is available for the iterative development loop. #ASEchat
  • teachingofsci Jun 5 @ 3:58 PM EDT
    same here; "how would your lesson next week be different because of being here today? Who could tell?" #asechat
    In reply to @MaryUYSEG
  • hrogerson Jun 5 @ 3:58 PM EDT
    #asechat conditions for successful professional learning from a session by Prof Shirley Simon from a few years ago.
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:58 PM EDT
    What do people think about CoT chartered teacher proposals? #asechat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @educationgovuk, @informed_edu
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:59 PM EDT
    2 mins left, &I didn’t get onto any of my planned questions. I’d like a real focus on PD & L as it relates to all science educators #ASEChat
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Jun 5 @ 3:59 PM EDT
    And failing that someone like @alomshaha ;) #asechat
    • alomshaha Jun 5 @ 3:52 PM EDT
      Best CPD resource is a kindly, smarter, more experienced teacher in same dept (rare in Physics)
      In reply to @A_Weatherall, @hrogerson, @SKLchem
  • MrsDrSarah Jun 5 @ 3:59 PM EDT
    I got loads of this during PGCE, do we assume others "just know" and/or are we afraid to ask for subject knowledge help? #asechat
    In reply to @alomshaha, @SKLchem, @A_Weatherall, @hrogerson