Sad to miss #WeirdEd tonight because I REALLY want to get input on this topic. Looking forward to gleaning wisdom when I can look through the chat #sadteacher
And I have made a choice, and I have chosen to participate in this week's #WeirdEd
Let's see how this works out
Many tweets to follow in the next hour.
#WeirdEd Indy relates to the topic! He fails all the time! It's one if the best parts of his movies. He's totally fallible. He also has zero impact of the outcome in Raiders
Rebecca has really in recent days
been dealing with a lack of discipline and diligence
in the student body to whom study
is beyond boring in spring and summer.
#WeirdEd#alliteration#halflines#poetry
I'm Mrs Altham from Maine. My week has been mostly marvelous. Today I spent time giving kids toys just to make them happy. Deal with it, curriculum. #WeirdEd
As for the week:
Thought Tuesday tâwas today - tried tweetin @TheWeirdTeacher to troubling thoughts tween thinkings till ââtwas transparent that tweets travailed till today #WeirdEd
#WeirdEd Ok, so I had planned to write questions for this week after our questionless experiements of the last few weeks but then didn't because life, so we'll keep tonight question free and just use guiding questions and flowing conversation. Like a chat.
I had a glass* of wine before #weirded tonight, so an alliterative introduction feels far from my reach at the moment.
*measurements? how do they even work?
#WeirdEd So let's just dive right on in. I'm thinking that Student Choice, while awesome, is used as a Magic Cure-All answer for motivation. How do we feel about student choice and what are some pros and cons to its implementation?
Choice is a mindset. How many students struggle to make a decision. Student need to be able to make a decision and see what opportunities come from it #weirded
#WeirdEd To continue with our alliterative theme: STRUCTURED student choice. Some kids may need the full Sudbury, but it's also darned inefficient sometimes.
#WeirdEd So let's just dive right on in. I'm thinking that Student Choice, while awesome, is used as a Magic Cure-All answer for motivation. How do we feel about student choice and what are some pros and cons to its implementation?
Student choice is both a motivator and a cop out at the same time. Students will chose the path of least resistance every time unless you ignite and fuel their absolute passions. #WeirdEd
Iâm struggling hard with student choice. I came into a wounded class who had little structure. I know that choice can help keep them engaged, but even the tiniest choice based activities go off the rails and I lose engagement. I keep trying, but it can be disheartening. #WeirdEd
I think student choice deferentially has it's ups and downs. I always found it helpful in school to have options to chose from when making a decision. So, guided and open student choice seems like a good option for students! #weirded
#WeirdEd Also, I'm biased right now bc I let my kids choose their TEDtalk topics with the idea that that would help motivate them to be more prepared, enthusiastic, and researched and well
Dangers of student choice is are we actually okay with student choice or are we preprogrammed to rescue too early (at least early in the career) Iâm okay with providing thoughts (pretty sure the groups plans to make everyone stop using oil wouldnât go as they hoped) #WeirdEd
I love student choice, but I have seen Ss make choices that have been hard for me. I want to see Ss succeed but seeing them fail due to their choices that been impactful even though hard to observe. The pros have definitely been engagement. #GrowthMindset#weirded
#WeirdEd So let's just dive right on in. I'm thinking that Student Choice, while awesome, is used as a Magic Cure-All answer for motivation. How do we feel about student choice and what are some pros and cons to its implementation?
#WeirdEd Also since Doug started me in alliterative mode you might be getting Old English half-lines from me for the whole chat. It just sort of starts spilling out like that.
Choice is a mindset. How many students struggle to make a decision. Student need to be able to make a decision and see what opportunities come from it #weirded
Building in guided inquiry first can make this an easier & better transition. Also tough to take over a class that seems to need some attention before it needs change. Prioritize. #weirded
#WeirdEd Indeed, before implementation, there needs to be the structure, attitudes, environment, the classroom needs to be set up or guided to the point that Ss can deal with being given that choice.
#weirded It is ONE of the tools I use for student buy-in. It is usually very successful at the high school level. I only use on occasion and usually for 1 of 2 things, timing of lesson activities or projects (summative/introductory)
I really appreciated reading about how you let students make "bad" choices. Honestly I think that's a huge part of life - you make choices, you deal with consequences. I hear a lot of folks blame others for letting them make bad choices... #weirded
Iâm good with students taking chances and failing along he say so long as there is something to be learned. Neighbor hated Ss âwasted timeâ and only doing things at last minute so I encouraged âitâs due tomorrowâ (unless working hard and showing need for more time) #WeirdEd
The Sudbury school model is the fully democratic, fully kid-autonomous model. Kids have to be on campus. They have resources. Adults are around if asked for. The kids do what they want. #WeirdEd
... when the problem might really be, "I made a choice, I don't like the consequences, and I don't know how to deal." If we don't let kids make 'bad' choices when we have safety nets up, then how will they know how to deal when the safety net is down? #weirded
A1: I can see if thereâs an easier choice, students choosing that option. However if itâs presented in a certain way, could students be challenged to choose the tougher option? #WeirdEd
Sigh. Yet despite being off task you probably got a nice reminder to out the book away - book becomes tablet and the world is burning! Same damn behaviour!! #weirded
#WeirdEd True story- I wrote that the night before TEDtalks started. Then the second talk was a kid who choose astrology, obviously knew nothing about his topic, and couldn't answer "What does astrology mean?" And I remembered that Educatus, the teacher god, laughs.
I really appreciated reading about how you let students make "bad" choices. Honestly I think that's a huge part of life - you make choices, you deal with consequences. I hear a lot of folks blame others for letting them make bad choices... #weirded
Thatâs my big excitement starting next year in the Fall. I can build in that structure and not have to put structure onto an existing class. #WeirdEd
I used it as the hook for Civil Rights unit. What do you want to learn about besides MLK and Rosa Parks? We hit some great topics & comparisons this semester & I learned some things too. #weirded
In reply to
@_SMasters, @nathan_stevens, @TheWeirdTeacher
Yeah - but also first time implementation dip. AND if first time kids have authentic choice (as I do via genius hour where I expect fails because itâs their first time and I donât expect first timers to be great) #weirded be kinder to yourself. Itâs an important project.
+ after which, some will move on to something "easier", some will give up entirely (telling me they can't do anything), and others will just copy +
#WeirdEd
I try to emphasize that we all make choices. The key is to see the opportunities that the choice creates. Look at which one is the best with the information that you have. Make another choice #weirded
#WeirdEd But it's NOT! That's what's worse. The chose their hobby project (first month of school) and killed it. Choose animal for animal project and killed it. This *explosion noises* My kids are trained up in choice.
That's a good point. One of my favourite quotes is from a gent named Alec Russell which goes something along the lines of, "We need to allow students to experience painful, non-catastrophic failure. It's called learning."
Yikes. I try not to destroy anything on purpose and save Parenr teachers for big deals (I expect some disassotiations in class because, well.... life) #weirded
I feel like my students can get their minds around it, in my classroom, where they come once a week and I don't give grades that go on the report card. Was much more of a struggle when I was a self-contained classroom teacher. #weirded
Yeah, I try to work things out before we get to "stuff for the boards" -- meaning I need their best to hang up on the board when the AP rolls by. And I want new names this time! #WeirdEd
At the #WGEDD conference, they talked about rubber balls vs glass balls. When building teacher leaders give them tasks that are rubber balls - if they drop them, it won't be catastrophic. Take same approach w/ Ss choice. #weirded
In reply to
@theedpodcast, @teacherofftopic, @TheWeirdTeacher
K. In which case blame the teacher. Or the librarian! Or spring break.....time change? Anxiety about speaking? @JerrySeinfeld says people fear public speaking more than death - so if at funeral most would rather be in casket than doing eulogy #weirded
#WeirdEd I don't want this to be a pile-on on student choice, either. Because I do like it and I think it's better than the other. But it ain't magic and can't be just done
In my class kids have choice in how they self-reg when needed. Tent, trampoline, swivel chair, soon will have a swing, etc... that seems to be working well #WeirdEd
When incorporating choice into my lessons... I make room for students to change their choice in case they end up hating the choice they made initially. Natural consequences like "now you might have less time for this" but no other penalty #weirded
So... maybe topic choice wasnât the issue with the TED talks? Student choice of how to spend research time- what to focus on?
Or something else... I also imagine that there wasnât some cool learning happening! #WeirdEd
The hard lesson I learned this year. Part of this summer will be partnering with a couple teachers I know to help me figure out laying groundwork next year. #WeirdEd
#weirded Failing forward is somewhat of a buzzphrase at the moment - engineering is all about failing and retrying the process; it also depends of the fail
In reply to
@nathan_stevens, @sidney_huhn, @TheWeirdTeacher, @weirded
When all else fails we always blame the librarian (I was okay causing disruptions via the room of books and techs and talks and plots) #weirded mind you my door sigh was librarIAN
In reply to
@MarciaDressel, @TheWeirdTeacher, @JerrySeinfeld
That makes total sense when the failure comes from trying something that did not work.
What about when the failure comes from just half-assing it? #WeirdEd
#weirded Failing forward is somewhat of a buzzphrase at the moment - engineering is all about failing and retrying the process; it also depends of the fail
In reply to
@nathan_stevens, @sidney_huhn, @TheWeirdTeacher, @weirded
#WeirdEd Whenever I hear "fail forward" I think about my endurance athlete buddies who would say "run until you can't, then walk. Walk until you fall, but fall forward."
#weirded Failing forward is somewhat of a buzzphrase at the moment - engineering is all about failing and retrying the process; it also depends of the fail
In reply to
@nathan_stevens, @sidney_huhn, @TheWeirdTeacher, @weirded
Thatâs what beta-testing is for- we work out the kinks... we trial-and-error so many things âin real lifeâ... so why is that such a big leap for school? #WeirdEd
In reply to
@_SMasters, @nathan_stevens, @sidney_huhn, @TheWeirdTeacher, @weirded
"letting students fail" I think is a difficult position for any teacher-in-training or new teacher, because maybe the relationships aren't built to the point of complete trust. But that doesn't make it wrong. Depends what the stakes are. #weirded
#WeirdEd I feel like that's something that may come w/not only experience, but also how one can effectively make it lead to, as @nathan_stevens says, "failing forward." so outsiders (like Admin) and parents can buy into it effectively so one doesnt get fired.
#WeirdEd Ok This is a HUGE point! We need to be training student and teacher failure into our student teachers, but that relationship is not often built to approve of failure because of everything else going on.
Thatâs where the reflection piece comes in, both for them and you. Yes, you failed, but why? And what needs to change to fix it? Same for you. If you can articulate what you learned from the experience, you get a lot more leeway. #WeirdEd
True. Failure sounds like something that happens to an O-ring on a space shuttle or Bill Buckner trying to catch a ground ball. Yeah, you learn, but it sounds like itâs too late. #WeirdEd
In reply to
@nathan_stevens, @_SMasters, @sidney_huhn, @TheWeirdTeacher, @weirded
My high school kids often have next to no sense of what they're interested in. See also: "freshmen undecideds" and the rise of the general studies major. #WeirdEd
I saw a edu phrase yesterday that Iâve seen quite a few times before and it got me curious so I searched twitter. Found it in a tweet from 2009. May be my new hobby. #weirded#backtothefuture
In reply to
@_SMasters, @nathan_stevens, @sidney_huhn, @TheWeirdTeacher, @weirded
#WeirdEd I'll be honest, and maybe it's bc I'm in elementary school, I almost never think about how a lesson will impact a student's specific job in the future. I think about the kid becoming an adult, but not becoming a part of the work force. Like I don't teach for the test.
In reply to
@polonerd, @tkraz, @nathan_stevens, @sidney_huhn, @weirded
Technically, you put a hash in front of it, and it becomes a hashtag, which becomes a chat!
(Brought to you by the people who hate ATM Machines and PIN Numbers)
#WeirdEd
In reply to
@tkraz, @nathan_stevens, @TheWeirdTeacher, @_SMasters, @sidney_huhn, @weirded
Acting (basically) solely as a facilitator in my classroom during Fishbowl Fridays is always gonna be the scariest and most rewarding role I've ever taken on. But, scary as it is to let go, the kids will AMAZE! Swear it! Love it! #WeirdEd
Thatâs where the negative connotation comes from! Not doing the work needed. Adults failing up into leadership positions... promoted to get them where they will do âless damageâ. Our students see this! #WeirdEd
I think one of the important things about student failure is that it's okay for them to fail, but when it is a repeated failure we must make sure they aren't giving up #weirdEd
I agree, but in a lot of situations you get to choose the process or medium to use to complete it. Sometimes choice isnât choosing the topic, but more of how to solve or address that topic (and sometimes you just have to say âdo it like thisâ) #WeirdEd
In reply to
@tkraz, @nathan_stevens, @sidney_huhn, @TheWeirdTeacher, @weirded
NO YOU ARE NOT.
I didn't pass the entire teacher-license thingy for my state until my very last try. It felt v "do or die."
It is đŻ percent okay for you to deal with it how you need to. I don't think I would have made it through the process without others' support. #weirded
#WeirdEd "Let the student fail" needs to be done the right way:
-- letting him goof off, not do work, until he's tired of zeroes & phone calls home is not what's meant +
#WeirdEd Shifting gears- How far will you let the kids in your class go towards catastrophic failure before stopping them? How does the situation impact this?
Iâve encouraged Student Teachers to create a lesson that will definitely go wrong - good to have some practice for when the lesson plan goes out the window (like the bird that distracts everyone and scared me!) #weirded
and the number of students dropping out of college after 1 year? They sit in rows, listen to lectures, take standardized tests... How in the world are they not ready to make choices & solve problems? #snark#weirded
#WeirdEd Itâs an interesting discussion since all business and entrepreneur gurus consistently emphasize that failure is crucial for learning, growth, and success of any kind but not in schools with students because they should get it right the first time
+ the productive struggle which doesn't produce the desired result but nonetheless provides teachable moments and learning is what we're aiming for. #WeirdEd
#WeirdEd in fact, itâs almost counter cultural how failure is espoused as essential for success yet in schools itâs to be avoided at all costs. We want to get Ss job ready but we make them fear failing which, from what Iâve read and heard, is a key to success.
I have a few students who will wait to check in with an adult to verify every answer they give. Learning to handle making a mistake (and fixing it) is part of becoming more independent 2/ #weirded
This is why Iâm skeptical of the push for STEM being rationalized as âThey need it for the future!â Yes, STEM is good to be teaching and builds other skills, but kids who are truly passionate will be able to train for those jobs even if they didnât build robots in Kinder #WeirdEd
In reply to
@TheWeirdTeacher, @polonerd, @tkraz, @nathan_stevens, @sidney_huhn, @weirded
One will freeze in the middle of a keyboarding program because it shows the mistakes in red. We need to learn how to not be perfect. So we try to encourage. 3/ #weirded
#weirded Foreign lang is HARD. Esp for Ss who normally "get it" without studying. I need help teaching resiliency because we get to do things that are hard in life and so can you.
I teach in a computer lab, so I can afford to let students fail pretty badly sometimes. Oh, you didn't follow my directions? Then you...
A) figured out a different way to do what I asked, or
B) were totally shut down by the computer being unable to read your mind
#weirded
I try not to let them go very far astray. The very idea that there is not One Right Way in reading and writing is still shocking and unsettling to a lot of my kids. #WeirdEd
And honestly the hardest part is getting the other adults to not give in to âhelpingâ when the student knows the answer. Reinforcing giving *an* answer even if itâs wrong. #weirded
Yes! We really donât want to encourage learned helplessnessâ always needing teacher feedback when things arenât perfect. Part of being human and making adjustments as needed. #WeirdEd
Iâve really learned this year that true passion trumps the need for a lesson, a class, a teacher, a school, anything. If a studentâs passion is great enough, itâs their world and we are just living in it, man. #WeirdEd
In reply to
@YennePaul, @TheWeirdTeacher, @polonerd, @tkraz, @nathan_stevens, @sidney_huhn, @weirded
Community college teacher here, and even though my freshmen and sophomores like some choice, they also donât know what they donât know. They were NOT happy when it was all on them. Happy compromise? I provide choices from pre-selected topics and sources.
#WeirdEd Well, one of the advantages of having manual save is, right before catastrophic failure or digital death, one can look at where one made mistake. Reflect, try a new way of tackling the obstacle, final boss, or even try a different outcome
In reply to
@teacherofftopic, @nathan_stevens, @TheWeirdTeacher
I have had to tell Ss lately that I will not help them with the math games websites they love, because then the game will keep giving them the questions they struggle with, & I won't always be there to help. Get it wrong, or figure it out... #weirded Both options are fine, kidsđ
#WeirdEd I speak video game now and it's always so unnerving when suddenly the game is giving you a ton of health and a save point right before a giant door. WHAT'S BEHIND THE DOOR
In reply to
@shadow_uzumaki, @teacherofftopic, @nathan_stevens
I think the biggest thing about letting students fail is 1) designing the task to be about the whole process in which failure is a natural part (engineering, writing, etc) not just the final product and grade and... #WeirdEd
I have to turn off spellcheck for some kids for the same reason. They can't focus on the task (like writing a paragraph) because they get caught up in the minutae. #weirded I want them to learn to live with some imperfection (temporarily - they can always fix it later!)
I design all my writing assignments to have a built-in "failure" process called "revision" but boy howdy is it tough to convince some of my writers that they need it #WeirdEd
#WeirdEd In general, sometimes failure means not redoing the entire work, but looking back and seeing "Huh, I only really need to fix this part." And start from there. Though sometimes, it really is that bad, like a save corruption, and one must..alas start from the beginning
In reply to
@teacherofftopic, @nathan_stevens, @TheWeirdTeacher
is this why minecraft auto-save makes me insane, but i love the auto-save in breath of the wild? #weirded yes, the answer is yes (note to self: stop falling in lava with pockets filled with diamonds)
In reply to
@shadow_uzumaki, @nathan_stevens, @TheWeirdTeacher
#WeirdEd Before we go I wanted to get into the attitude around those who are reluctant to allow choice, or the kinds of choice Thought Leaders (tm) on here think should be.
I argue there's a lot of factors that go into allowing student choice in a classroom. Thoughts?
#WeirdEd But even when starting from beginning, we know more than we knew in the beginning, often times, enough that we bypass and move faster than before
In reply to
@teacherofftopic, @nathan_stevens, @TheWeirdTeacher
Can't let this opportunity go by without mentioning that some children are less likely to be trusted with choice because they might use it to disrupt comfortable white middle-class dreams #WeirdEd
Completely right #weirded - ever notice how much less stressful it is when there isnât a phonebook of menu choices at a restaurant. Choice can be good but too much choice can be overwhelming!
I had a class this semester that needed stability, relationship and consistency much more than they needed (or could handle) choice as a whole group. Not every group of kids can handle the kind of choice that others can. Important to be able to read the room. #WeirdEd
#WeirdEd For example, I think you need a good mix of the right personal mindset, the right school attitude, the right admin, the right team for student choice and failure to work. Especially for failure to work. You need people around you who understand bad results are results.
Not sure if this is what youâre going for, but in science I definitely stopped complete student choice on science project topics and animals couldnât be involved. I had a student test the effects of pesticide residue in water using goldfish... #WeirdEd
"Fail fast, fail forward, fail often" is just saying"learn your way through it" in a way that sells a lot of books or lands ya on the TED stage. Nobody wants failure. Everyone wants learning. #weirded
In reply to
@_SMasters, @nathan_stevens, @sidney_huhn, @TheWeirdTeacher, @weirded
when teachers don't have opportunity to exercise agency (choices), it can be difficult to provide opportunities to exercise agency (choices) to students, unless we challenge ourselves to think about choice a little differently. #weirded
Learn how #theteachersjourney can help you reflect on your own path as you share in the stories of 7 incredible educators (and me) to learn about growth, balance, mentoring, and life. #weirded PS forgive the tweeted eduquotos, but @johnwick photos are insanely grea
The first draft sucks.
The second draft is good.
The third draft is great.
But you have to write the first draft first.
(paraphrasing from Anne Lamott, naturally) #WeirdEd
In reply to
@ImTheRealReRe, @teacherofftopic, @TheWeirdTeacher, @annemdelgado
School attitude and culture are a HUGE part of it. Itâs hard when you have a few teachers who let their students fail and a few who donât. #WeirdEd
My favorite restaurant has FOUR options. I want to look at a menu and choose what I want in like 30 sec. Maybe we need more of that in classrooms #WeirdED
why has no one stoppedme from failing on this whole wine thing you guys
i was gonna just have a glass
it turned out the whole bottle was glass #weirded
In reply to
@polonerd, @nathan_stevens, @TheWeirdTeacher, @mrburkemath, @MrsAltham, @YennePaul, @tkraz, @sidney_huhn, @weirded
You take whatever you're currently doing and then say it's wrong.
Now you've created a job of the future, and conveniently, it's a perpetual cash cow. #WeirdEd
In reply to
@tkraz, @TheWeirdTeacher, @YennePaul, @polonerd, @nathan_stevens, @sidney_huhn, @weirded
The curriculum is the discussion, not the content. Structure learning around inquiry and problem solving. As long as Ss are improving at those skills, the content can vary and they'll be prepared. #weirded
In reply to
@tkraz, @TheWeirdTeacher, @YennePaul, @nathan_stevens, @sidney_huhn, @weirded
Interesting thread here. If they donât learn about choices when theyâre younger and in elementary school, this looks like a burden not an opportunity in later years. #WeirdEd
My first day on the job this semester I was asked what I drank. I said âbeerâ, she said, âdouble however much your drinking nowâ. I laughed at her. I was wrong to laugh. #WeirdEd
In reply to
@teacherofftopic, @polonerd, @nathan_stevens, @TheWeirdTeacher, @mrburkemath, @MrsAltham, @tkraz, @sidney_huhn, @weirded
Yeah đłđŹ Was both shocked and a little terrified when she brought the project in. Lesson learned, the hard way, sometimes limiting student choice and having caveats is a good thing. #WeirdEd
