#ALedchat is a weekly chat on Twitter about education topics. It is held each Monday from 9-10pmCST. While the discussion on #ALedchat continues on Twitter well beyond our weekly one-hour chat session, this platform affords us the opportunity to extend, expand and share the conversation with an even greater audience. Educators from across the state of Alabama, and the world, can come here to find encouragement, support, resources, professional growth opportunities and advice, while providing the same to their colleagues.
Welcome to #ALedchat! Tell us who you are, your role in education and where you are tweeting from. Add a GIF if you want to continue the tradition :) #ALedchat
Holly Sutherland, Superintendent of Haleyville City, AL. Co-founder of this chat and #USedchat. Everyone is welcome to join our chat. We love to learn from and with you! #ALedchat
Dr. Matt Kiser, Principal of @EdgewoodElem in the @HomewoodSchools , professor, and co-moderator of #ALedchat Looking forward to sharpening the saw with y'all!
In reply to
@DrHSutherland, @EdgewoodElem, @HomewoodSchools
I'm Jennifer, Hoover High School AP. Co-founder of this chat and #USedchat. Rising tide for all women in leadership. Excited to be back with everyone tonight! #ALedchat
Dr. Matt Kiser, Principal of @EdgewoodElem in the @HomewoodSchools , professor, and co-moderator of #ALedchat Looking forward to sharpening the saw with y'all!
In reply to
@DrHSutherland, @EdgewoodElem, @HomewoodSchools
I'm Jennifer, Hoover High School AP. Co-founder of this chat and #USedchat. Rising tide for all women in leadership. Excited to be back with everyone tonight! #ALedchat
Jennifer Northrup, library media specialist in Hoover. Tweeting from my bed for as long as I can! I actually made it to 9 tonight! It’s been awhile. #ALedchat
Jennifer Northrup, library media specialist in Hoover. Tweeting from my bed for as long as I can! I actually made it to 9 tonight! It’s been awhile. #ALedchat
A1: I believe the state should be hold everyone accountability through some type of measure. However, teacher input into what the best measure is, would be nice. #aledchat
Like assessment in a classroom, assessment of schools within a state can be enlightening.
Are there problems with the statewide assessment? Of course.
#ALedchat
A1 - I think it is important so that we are able to collaborate with others to see what is working and not working in our schools and it gives us a base to start conversations! #ALedchat
A1 It’s important to hold schools accountable but without interrupting regularly scheduled learning for close to 2 months. *Cough*PARCC*Cough #ALedchat
A1: A relevant standard is a great start; has to be able to quantify growth and determine how well a school is doing compared to its prior success; got to be a tool that is intended to provide information, not a way to bring schools down. Everyone is doing great things #ALedchat
A1- I do think it’s important to compare apples to apples but I would sure love it if all the private schools who are now up for state money to adhere to the same policies
A1 It is important for all citizens to know how great schools & their students are, but that systemic accountability measure needs to be transparent & meaningful to the schools themselves too. #ALedchat
A1: I’m trying to find what’s positive about it. We have studied results & reaching out to folks who had good scores in areas we know we can improve. Like Academic Growth. #ALedchat
A1: I think an accountability measure is very important to monitor achievement however, we should know how we are going to be measure for effectiveness. #ALedchat
A1: All great in theory, but actual teachers aren’t an integral part of the development or implementation of the system. Like, I’m not involved in developing medical practice or supermarket management accountability for obvious reasons. #ALedchat
Great point; it should be used as a diagnostic to support the good work going on across the state. There are far too many aspects worth noting to make the assessment the end all, be all. #ALedchat
Like assessment in a classroom, assessment of schools within a state can be enlightening.
Are there problems with the statewide assessment? Of course.
#ALedchat
A1: Having a systematic statewide accountability measure is very important. We do need to deeply consider what we are assessing, and what we feel is most important that our students learn to have the best system of accountability to measure our schools. #ALedchat
A1) at least here in Florida (and you can tell from reading my bio on here that I I’m well versed in this topic) public education has some major competition so accountability is marketability as its open game here for enrollment and FTE! #ALedchat
A1: Inequity in education has been around a long time. I think there needs to be accountability as a measure of equity & if students are meeting standards. #ALedchat
A1. I think it’s important as long as it is fair and applies to all schools receiving public funds (Wisconsin has state-wide private voucher from public money used to be exempt). It provides some insights into the school environment. They don’t often show other data #ALedchat
A1: It’s important to be able to compare but the measurement needs to be in aligned with measurable and valid standards. This would allow some amazing conversations to happen. #ALedchat
A2- There’s not enough importance on making growth. We don’t I’ll start with the same incoming product. We should be judged on what we do with what we have. #Aledchat
A1- I do think it’s important to compare apples to apples but I would sure love it if all the private schools who are now up for state money to adhere to the same policies
A1 #aledchat thats tough, so many schools with so many different challenges but all should be assessed to be successful. I leave this to the experts in the field.
A1: I’m trying to find what’s positive about it. We have studied results & reaching out to folks who had good scores in areas we know we can improve. Like Academic Growth. #ALedchat
A2: Morale, morale, morale, and climate! Nothing can destroy a school faster than the community thinking their schools are not good according to an arbitrary score. #aledchat
A1: Having a systematic statewide accountability measure is very important. We do need to deeply consider what we are assessing, and what we feel is most important that our students learn to have the best system of accountability to measure our schools. #ALedchat
A1: Accountability isn’t a bad thing, but the measures used should be known on the front-end. It’s difficult to hit moving targets. The measures should also reflect the whole child and all aspects of a school— rather than one “test”. #RedefiningReady#ALedchat
A2 Publicly shaming teachers using something that is often times not an accurate representation of the work they do on a daily basis is a terrible idea #ALedchat
A2: It is tough enough explaining to stakeholders what an A means vs what a B means in the classroom, and now we tie a letter to a school? Very confusing and misleading. Esp when the yardstick used to measure changed up into the final hours of rolling it out! #aledchat
A2: Morale, morale, morale, and climate! Nothing can destroy a school faster than the community thinking their schools are not good according to an arbitrary score. #aledchat
See schools, charter and profit, for...negative grades and perceptions breed competition, not necessarily a bad thing as long as playing field even #ALedchat
A1: Accountability and transparency are important. However, we must be clear on what we're actually measuring. Assessments should be about growth and progress, not comparing schools/systems, not bringing anyone down. #ALEdChat
This is so true! We don't call students a complete failure if they don't ace one test; why is it okay to do that for entire districts/schools? #ALedchat
A2: Morale, morale, morale, and climate! Nothing can destroy a school faster than the community thinking their schools are not good according to an arbitrary score. #aledchat
A2 - A huge negative I see with and A to F report card is schools that are receiving an F still have some great teachers and great things happening but are rarely highlighted because of the schools overall F score #ALedchat
A2: It certainly didn’t tell me anything that we ALL didn’t already know especially in comparison of schools and districts, but our stakeholders know what an A-F means, not how it was determined. #ALedchat
A2: It seems as if the negatives are highlighted and overshadow the good that happens in schools. If there was true constructive criticism meant to help schools improve, that would be better. #ALedchat
A2: Absurd components to the score aside, what exactly does A-F mean? To what are we comparing ourselves? Each other? What we believe an ideal school should be? Schools in Sweden? I need clarity. #ALedchat
A2:Just as letter grades do not always depict the whole picture for a student, an A-F report fails to do so for schools as well. Schools are more than a letter. They are a culmination of many factors, all of which need to be made known. #ALedchat
So true! Schools all have unique challenges and there are great folks in each of them. There are so many factors that must synergize in order to achieve the A. #Aledchat
A2 - A huge negative I see with and A to F report card is schools that are receiving an F still have some great teachers and great things happening but are rarely highlighted because of the schools overall F score #ALedchat
A2: All schools with an A are treated the same, all schools with a B the same, and so on and so forth. People see the grade and think that’s the end to the story. But, there are variables that need to be looked at and explored. #ALedchat
A2. Often it can be confusing or it leads to blame with a bad score. Whose fault is it? Additionally, they only measure certain high stakes metrics (we use ACT statewide) while glossing over other great things. #ALedchat
A2: Absurd components to the score aside, what exactly does A-F mean? To what are we comparing ourselves? Each other? What we believe an ideal school should be? Schools in Sweden? I need clarity. #ALedchat
What about having standards-based grading for school report cards. What if we stopped calling them report cards and called them performance reviews? #ALedchat
A2: It is tough enough explaining to stakeholders what an A means vs what a B means in the classroom, and now we tie a letter to a school? Very confusing and misleading. Esp when the yardstick used to measure changed up into the final hours of rolling it out! #aledchat
A2: Not knowing the factors that contribute to a school receiving the score causes people to speculate and automatically think the grade is reflects the teaching. #EDL577UM#UMedTech#ALedchat
A2: Schools & communities are all so very different with so many different variables. Super tough to standardize totally. I’ve worked in 3 school systems. All so different. Hard to fairly measure. #ALedchat
#aledchat A2: Communities expectations are always high and should be but when someone tells them they arent as good as the next county over its devastating and not a building block
Q3: What accountability measures do you feel are essential to painting a clear picture of your school? Please include what type of school you are referring to (Prim, Elem, Inter, MS, HS). #ALedchat
A2: The pressure that comes with the grade 4 all schools, regardless of where on the spectrum they fall. There are so many factors that go into making school happen each day, hard to take just a few and determine the overall impact of a school by that singular measure #ALedchat
Q2: Being a pre-service teacher from Oklahoma, the schools here operate on the same system, but it has begun to start earlier and earlier, which I feel doesn't benefit the younger students #ALedchat
A2: Well, for starters ... 90% of the “grade” was based on outcomes of ONE test that we dropped because it wasn’t aligned to standards. This leads to a misinformed public & does nothing to bring about solutions. Twitter doesn’t allow me enough characters to keep going #ALedchat
Yep, no test is going to show that you bring breakfast to the student each morning, or that you consoled him when his mom went to rehab, or that you helped her get through a big breakup. (etc.) More to education than just Xs & Os. #BOTH#ALedchat
Nice points, I think when we get into items such as the quantification of parent involvement and social emotional development, it can be a slippery slope as these often are not readily impacted by the school/district themselves. #ALedchat
Q3: What accountability measures do you feel are essential to painting a clear picture of your school? Please include what type of school you are referring to (Prim, Elem, Inter, MS, HS). #ALedchat
A3: I think it’s essential to give credit for all the “extras” schools do. I work w/ K-12. We have amazing fine arts experiences for all Ss. I mean exceptional. Measure that, please. Lifelong benefits. #ALedchat
Q3: What accountability measures do you feel are essential to painting a clear picture of your school? Please include what type of school you are referring to (Prim, Elem, Inter, MS, HS). #ALedchat
Q3: What accountability measures do you feel are essential to painting a clear picture of your school? Please include what type of school you are referring to (Prim, Elem, Inter, MS, HS). #ALedchat
Q3: What accountability measures do you feel are essential to painting a clear picture of your school? Please include what type of school you are referring to (Prim, Elem, Inter, MS, HS). #ALedchat
A3: MS; Attendance, parent involvement, social skills, reading & math proficiency levels, and actual growth per child. Everyone learns differently and at a different pace! #EDL577UM#UMedTech#ALedchat
It's definitely not motivating! Why not say, "Let's learn what we can from them." Every school/community is different, but there are common qualities of cultures that lead to excellence. #ALedchat
A3: Student growth and student achievement in a high school setting. But the data needs to be broken down even further to discover which students are growing and which are not. That analysis will reveal some answers about how to improve instruction in the whole school. #ALedchat
A2: What bothers me more than the idea of the A-F standardized reporting is some of the ridiculous components that AL believes should be used to determine that grade. #ALedchat
A3: growth from year to year based on the individual...not a particular subgroup. If we are going to differentiate then we need to that in all aspects—HS #ALedchat
A3. HS - I get measuring test scores and graduation rates, but include things like educational opportunities, participation in extra curricular activities (we have lots of apprenticeship Ss), maybe staff professional development (advanced degree seeking). #ALedchat
A3: K-2 schools should be accountable for foundational reading skills, oral language, and early numeracy. If a child cannot READ, what will they do in life? #BuildingaReader#aledchat
Great points; how about the growth of a 10th grader that goes from 52% proficient to 75%, is that not more impressive than growth from 91% to 92%? #ALedchat
A3: Student growth and student achievement in a high school setting. But the data needs to be broken down even further to discover which students are growing and which are not. That analysis will reveal some answers about how to improve instruction in the whole school. #ALedchat
A3: HS: Individual student growth as well as performance info, student feedback survey, extra-curricular participation, college & career indicators met. #ALedchat
A3: I do not think attendance should count- I had a student loose a gmom and a few weeks later had the flu- they are now labeled as being chronically absent. I didn't come to wrk when my grmom passed, nor do when I have the flu @GraysonLawrence makes me go home) #aledchat
A4: As @emilybharris says “Data don’t lie” looking at student growth and constant reflection of school goals leads to instructional changes that result in learning gains. Challenges would be making sure we are helping kids move. #ALedchat
Q3: What accountability measures do you feel are essential to painting a clear picture of your school? Please include what type of school you are referring to (Prim, Elem, Inter, MS, HS). #ALedchat
A4- Each school will face it’s own challenges based on the make up of your school! We should take the challenges we face by the horns and overcome them because we should have a goal of every student succeeds no matter what grade we get! #ALedchat
A3: student and parent culture surveys, student retention %’s, growth measures for students in that school - not previous, would love a teacher growth piece - pursuing advanced degrees or additional staff development, which most are, could go on and on (middle level) #ALedchat
A4: Due to the diversity of each school/district, there are few absolutes that can be used consistently to determine a measure. Scores on standardized tests have a place for sure, but how much should they be worth? Definitely don't like the attendance component #ALedchat
A4: Ss are judged based on a single performance at a single moment and compared to a level where someone who doesn’t know anything about them thinks they should be right then. #ALedchat
A4: The logistics of how to measure these. How can we measure something so vast as student achievement and student growth? Tests are easy to use, but are they the best way to measure our students’ growth and consider all the factors in an objective setting? #ALedchat
Why not have a “portfolio” type component with evidence of how you provide experiences that prepare students for real-life, reflect community efforts, etc. in addition to measuring growth on whatever accountability assessment adopted. Could have a rubric to use ... #ALedchat
Q3: What accountability measures do you feel are essential to painting a clear picture of your school? Please include what type of school you are referring to (Prim, Elem, Inter, MS, HS). #ALedchat
A2: NJ rolled out something similar. Property values suffer & the state increases the socioeconomic stratification among communities. Ends up concentrating resources and perpetuating the cycle of bad property values. #ALedchat
That's because @GraysonLawrence gets it! He understands the importance of relationship and a hierarchy of needs. Can't tackle Bloom's until you handle Maslow #ALedchat
A3: I do not think attendance should count- I had a student loose a gmom and a few weeks later had the flu- they are now labeled as being chronically absent. I didn't come to wrk when my grmom passed, nor do when I have the flu @GraysonLawrence makes me go home) #aledchat
A4 Some of the challenges we face when debating the departure from traditional accountability measures stems from the difficulty to quantify student progress on new expectations. However, we must harness our collaborative efforts for positive accountability change #aledchat
I believe that a thorough evaluation of how students are responding to the way teachers are teaching their lessons is a really important way to evaluate schools #ALedchat
A3: HS: I’m against assessing schools on things like attendance and parent involvement- we have limited control over these things. Let’s look instead at growth, achievement, and CCR (not grad rate- a degree doesn’t mean much if you are not CCR). #ALedchat
#aledchat A4: I grew up in urban area taught in rural, when we let all the kids walk to the square to watch the parade I freaked and then I was told they will come back the buses are their ride home. measure that?
A4: I love data. I do. But I can focus on it so much, I forget the very important life skills: being on time, being conscientious, caring about & serving other people, understanding how to have a fabulous dinner conversation. #challenges#ALedchat
How do you count extra-curricular participation..and not count the same student more than once because he is involved in 12 different things? The way we did it does not even make sense... #aledchat
A4: How do we measure growth? What type of data should we gather? How does teacher prof. dev. relate to student achievement? How do we measure student emotional needs? #aledchat
If you took a snapshot of me in 9th grade, you’d see a goofy kid that was lost as a goose in his geometry class. Well, guess what I know a lot about and what I’m teaching nowadays. #ALEdChat
A5: 100%. Every school has unique goals and challenges, and those should be considered. When an individual school meets goals specific to that institution, that should be celebrated. #ALedchat
A5 Including individual school goals/measures alludes to the diversity in our schools. Our students have a variety of strengths. Including these measures allows us to celebrate our Ss successes while planning next steps to support their continuous growth #aledchat
Great point! And to that point, do schools that can only offer a few activities get penalized for not offering as many as others? Just thinking we could change one set of issues for another #ALedchat
How do you count extra-curricular participation..and not count the same student more than once because he is involved in 12 different things? The way we did it does not even make sense... #aledchat
How do you count extra-curricular participation..and not count the same student more than once because he is involved in 12 different things? The way we did it does not even make sense... #aledchat
A5. As long as it is a generic component to leave open local control. Goals for one school will not be the same for all schools in a state and schools have to have a solid way to measure success towards those goals. #aledchat
A5 - Yes I think they should be because who better to have a part in the accountability than the school itself with it’s own personal goals! We educators can be tougher on ourselves sometimes than outsiders! #ALedchat
A3: HS-employment after graduation, enrollment in 2 or 4yr college, enrollment in trade school, rate of degree/training certification completion, # of unique participants in extra-curricular activities, annual school climate inventory. #ALedchat
Q3: What accountability measures do you feel are essential to painting a clear picture of your school? Please include what type of school you are referring to (Prim, Elem, Inter, MS, HS). #ALedchat
#ALedchat A3: HS: I’m against assessing schools on things like attendance and parent involvement- we have limited control over these things. Let’s look instead at growth, achievement, and CCR (not grad rate- a diploma doesn’t mean much if you are not CCR). #ALedchat
I agree with the CCR, but the one used this year was from two years prior. The Grad Rate used was from the year prior- So we were judged on two different outgoing classes? That wasn't a good metric #aledchat
#ALedchat A3: HS: I’m against assessing schools on things like attendance and parent involvement- we have limited control over these things. Let’s look instead at growth, achievement, and CCR (not grad rate- a diploma doesn’t mean much if you are not CCR). #ALedchat
I know! We did too! How do we paint an accurate picture of our involvement if we have more students involved than our actual number of student enrolled? Haha! #aledchat
A3: HS-employment after graduation, enrollment in 2 or 4yr college, enrollment in trade school, rate of degree/training certification completion, # of unique participants in extra-curricular activities, annual school climate inventory. #ALedchat
Q3: What accountability measures do you feel are essential to painting a clear picture of your school? Please include what type of school you are referring to (Prim, Elem, Inter, MS, HS). #ALedchat
Question for classroom teachers: Was your classroom affected by the statewide assessment? As in, were you spoken to about meeting a certain standard to improve your school's grade?
I know I wasn't...just curious.
#ALedchat
I agree with the CCR, but the one used this year was from two years prior. The Grad Rate used was from the year prior- So we were judged on two different outgoing classes? That wasn't a good metric #aledchat
#ALedchat A3: HS: I’m against assessing schools on things like attendance and parent involvement- we have limited control over these things. Let’s look instead at growth, achievement, and CCR (not grad rate- a diploma doesn’t mean much if you are not CCR). #ALedchat
Question for admin:
Did you speak to any teachers about doing this or that to help your school's grade? Did your central office ask your school to do/not do something for the school's grade?
#ALedchat
I think one issue is that sometimes schools set goals that they KNOW they can meet but that don't further their mission. All to get the checkmark for the report card. #ALedchat
A5: Absolutely, yes! Those goals should include the voice from/of the local school community - the ones who should know the school the best and speak to the ‘why’ of the measures and the ‘how’ of the process. #ALedchat
I agree. It's important for schools to set goals and important for them to work hard to meet them. The goal needs to be set based on something that needs improvement. #aledchat
A3: HS-employment after graduation, enrollment in 2 or 4yr college, enrollment in trade school, rate of degree/training certification completion, # of unique participants in extra-curricular activities, annual school climate inventory. #ALedchat
Q3: What accountability measures do you feel are essential to painting a clear picture of your school? Please include what type of school you are referring to (Prim, Elem, Inter, MS, HS). #ALedchat
A6: Help help and help! Shouldn’t that be what we do for our kids no matter what zip code they live in? If you can name which politician I stole that from you get 100% #ALedchat
A6: for one year? or, for 5, 7, 9 plus years in a row? These answers prompt different responses based on amount of time the school has had to get goals met and to show an upward trend. Most schools in need won’t turnaround in a single year (generalization, I know). #ALedchat
A5: I see that this is not a popular opinion, but I do not think local indicators should be included. I think there is value in creating local indicators; but when we tie them to accountability, schools will select easy indicators rather than areas in need of growth. #ALedchat
A6: Begin analyzing and determining why those schools fell short. We are too quick to punish, judge, and mock schools. How about visiting those schools and talking to teachers and building administrators? We need to learn about the issues before we cast judgement. #ALedchat
A6: 🤔 this a great question! I want to say have some type of intervention strategy in place to help that school meet their goal within a set period of time. #EDL577Um#UMedTech#ALedchat
A6: We should take away all their resources. (I’m kidding. Like that would ever happen. Right?)
Schools that don’t meet expectations clearly need help in meeting their kids’ needs. Give it to them. #ALedchat
A6: I think there has to be an intervention plan just like we would do with a student who did not meet grade-level expectations. We really could all help each other more. Best learning I have is when I visit another school. And then implement what I learned. #ALedchat
A6: Seek to understand the school and why it failed or had low scores. Then help them in those areas rather than negatively judge and critique them. #ALedchat
A6. In Wisconsin after 2 years of failure schools face sanctions which could mean being taken over or turned into private voucher or chart schools. I feel improvement plans until meeting expectations is more appropriate. #ALedchat
A6: Sadly, I don’t think so. As leaders, we still need objective feedback. Too much subjectivity can lead to rose-colored-glasses syndrome that renders us incapable of recognizing systemic breakdowns. A matrix of indicators is preferable to a letter-grade-based system. #ALedchat
Q6: The district should make changes or work with the school to make improvements to help increase the problems they see happening. That way the district is aware that their are problems that need fixing #ALedchat
A6: The same thing that we would do for students. Analyze the data, determine strengths and weaknesses, set goals, formulate a plan, and then progress monitor and adjust as needed. Fully funding them would probably be beneficial too. #aledchat
A6: Yes! Again, A-F are predominantly used because it’s quick(er) & easier. Those writing the law want it for parents to understand, which is great but school is changing (at least it should be) It’s like using an overhead as an example of effective technology. #dated#ALedchat
A5: The same thing that we would do for students. Analyze the data, determine strengths and weaknesses, set goals, formulate a plan, and then progress monitor and adjust as needed. Fully funding them would probably be beneficial too. #Aledchat
FA: I have learned that we all know the importance of achievement, but the opinion of how we assess it varies as well as what we need to do about it. This idea needs some serious attention for improvement. #ALedchat
A6: The same thing that we would do for students. Analyze the data, determine strengths and weaknesses, set goals, formulate a plan, and then progress monitor and adjust as needed. Fully funding them would probably be beneficial too. #Aledchat
A6: You can’t get a full view of the school without some standard accountability system, but there’s so much more to the picture than that. That can’t be the only thing you look at when assessing a school. #ALedchat
FA. We all agree there needs to be a system for evaluation but agreeing on all the metrics would be very difficult as different areas/schools have different needs/expectations. #ALedchat
FA: I've learned that others feel the same way I do about attendance, as well as viewing student progress as a major indicator for accountability #ALedchat#UMedTech#EDL577UM
Thanks for an awesome chat! We have a long way to go, but healthy debate, ideas and suggestions from those in the trenches can only help us grow and improve! #aledchat
FQ: I sense a need to expand the components of our report card. Let it better represent the comprehensive work that takes place in a school every single day. #ALedchat
A7: I do not like the letter grade. Schools can be “graded” but results need to be clear rather than a letter grade, so everyone is on the same page for future improvement. Local indicators need to be included. We know us better than blanket goals set for us. #ALedchat
FA - I learned that we all struggle with the A to F grade but we agree that there should be some sort of accountability out there! I personal feel that if we can focus more on the positive things that are happening in our schools then the negative things will reduce #aledchat
FA- We all need to be assessed but how we do and who does it is still up for debate. Bottom line : always push yourself and your school and don’t wait for the state assessment to be the motivating factor in what makes you better. #ALedchat
FA: I learned that we agree that a systematic state accountability measurement is important. WHAT we are measuring needs to be discussed, and HOW we can improve to get a full view of the schools. We must always remember the WHY, which is doing the best for our students. #ALedchat
