#DITCHbook was created by Ditch That Textbook author Matt Miller. The chat focuses on innovative teaching ideas and disrupting standard textbook education.
Tonight's #DitchBook topic:
A REAL talk about cheating ... the copy/paste cheating variety and others.
We're always better when we share our thoughts on ideas like this!
A1: S motivation to cheat is often b/c the focus is on the GRADE at the end of the semester/year–not on the LEARNING. As Ts, we must remember that we do what we do b/c we value LEARNING. I've yet to find a T that got into education b/c they love to GRADE. #DitchBook
Annie StewArt from Kansas, I teach hs, kids have 9+ yrs being compliant. There's so much pressure to to be right, to get the grade. They aren't as interested in learning
#DitchBook
A1. It makes it easy and they can move on to the next thing. Some do not have the confidence that their own skills are good enough so this will make the teacher think they are smart. .. I tell my Ss the truth always comes out and I Google everything #ditchbook
A1: Students are motivated to cheat because they don't care/want to know the information that's on the test. They haven't learned it and are looking for the easy grade to move on. #ditchbook
A1. Fear of failure. Lack of understanding of the subject. Lack of understanding the requirements for the assignment. More important things to deal with in their lives then the work we assign them. #DitchBook
A1: I think it shows that students are not engaged in the assignment. Or, they don't know how to complete it. Or, unfortunately, a bad rapport with the teacher. #DitchBook
A1: Motivation to cheat is as different as each S.
1) frustrated/not knowing how to complete the work.
2) no time to complete it
3) no desire to actually do it themselves
#DitchBook
A1: Could be lack of readiness, overwhelmed, or maybe they don’t see the importance of learning the content so they just look off someone else. #DitchBook
A1: Student that cheat are focused on the end result, not necessarily the learning that should have taken them there. There are any number of reasons for this, teachers have ask them selves what role they play in this problem. #ditchbook
A1 It's easy today and many teachers don't seem to care that much. We also model theft of work a lot in our lessons (Hello Google Image Search, let me steal everything from you...) #ditchbook
A1 They want a good grade and they aren't invested in their learning--so someone else's thinking lets them check the proverbial box--and they can focus on what's important to them. Ditch cheating w lessons that engage students and promote independent thinkiers. #ditchbook
You and me both! Just had a case of plagiarism today... Made me think... What can I do better to empower my student and adjust my assignment to encourage more independent thinking? #ditchbook
A1: It's true that students forget and don't know how sometimes.
But I really believe they cheat many times because they don't see a good reason for doing our assignments. They don't see the benefit. #DitchBook
A1: Timing. Ss are crunched for time. There is only so few hours in the day and sometimes it feels like at least you are providing an answer even if it is someone elses answer. #ditchbook
It's been FASCINATING to see how many people have said, "I've been talking about this" or "We just had a discussion about this" regarding tonight's topic. Can't wait to see our group's take. #DitchBook
In reply to
@zmiller3820, @DitchThatTxtbk, @KarlyMoura, @SEANJFAHEY, @TaraMartinEDU, @craigklement, @burgessdave, @TTmomTT, @rlfreedm, @emosier3
A1: #Ditchbook They cheat because they are afraid of being wrong...they don't see the greatest successes because they are afraid to fail along the way.
Yep exactly. The focus is getting a grade for completing it, rather than the focus on the learning process. In the words of @ShakeUpLearning in her new book: It’s the game of school #ditchbook#shakeuplearning
A1: Motivation to cheat seems to be a coping mechanism to avoid the feeling of failure or of potential failure. I see students who are afraid to try anything new because of the fear they feel daily, whether it’s of how they are perceived by others or themselves. #DitchBook
You can make students COMPLY, but can you really make them learn?
If content delivery is our job, we're no different than pizza delivery drivers.
It's our job to INSPIRE, to MOTIVATE, to MAKE CONNECTIONS.
From my post on copy/paste cheating: https://t.co/q8vbUMw6VZ#DitchBook
Expectations are a big reason why they cheat ... James nailed it. Because what if they don't live up to the bar they've set for themselves -- or that others have set? #DitchBook
A.1 I believe Ss cheat at times because they lack ownership of their work and just want to get it over with to move on. Typically when tech assignments aren't engaging or have student voice included. #ditchbook
A1: Students cheat mostly bc they don't understand and/or appreciate the value of true learning yet. If we help them see the value in learning, cheating happens less often. Of course, that also requires US to know the value of what we're teaching. #ditchbook
A1) with assignments I think it’s ignorance, what is “your own words” or how much to change for it to become your take on the ideas. With tests I think it’s pressure to perform. A generation who thinks failure on test = self worth #DitchBook
A1 #DitchBook "Ms. S, do you even know how much I have to do?!" Between sports, work, school, chores, friends, life...HW is rarely even has a fighting chance
Yep exactly. The focus is getting a grade for completing it, rather than the focus on the learning process. In the words of @ShakeUpLearning in her new book: It’s the game of school #ditchbook#shakeuplearning
A3: I agree. But not for the reason your quote alluded to. We should be measuring skills and each student is different. There should be no way they can cheat if they are being assessed the right way and for the right reasons. #ditchbook
A2: The one good thing from these tools is that it makes Ss more creative and problem-solvers–just not in a way we intended in our class. Ss will find a way to cheat if they "need" to. They're all creative in their own ways. #DitchBook
We definitely should do more to make work something students feel proud of creating and empowered to show off. Not just another thing "they have to do". #ditchbook
A2. I do not think tools will ever help or stop. It is the individual who cheats and not the tool that enables it. We are reading the Perefect Score allowed @RobBuyea and Ss see SS pressured to perform and that drove the cheating. #ditchbook
Great point! If there is no care or investment, of course they will take the "easy" way out by "cheating." Need to empower and encourage ownership. #ditchbook
A1: students cheat when they are not connecting to what needs to be learned. They don’t have an answer to why they need to know it or that answer is not relevant to them. #DitchBook
A2: The tools do not change the situation. Ss need tasks that are engaging and make cheating difficult and not desirable. I can catch countless student cheating using these tools- but is easier to make tasks that make them not want to cheat! #DitchBook
A2: They hurt the issue because it just encourages the students to find a different way to cheat instead. They spend more time cheating/trying to cheat than studying and doing well. #ditchbook
A1. Ss care more about "the correct answer" more than comprehension. Fear of failure or looking foolish for not knowing the answer. Kids also dont know how to properly use resources. #DitchBook
A2: With tech, Ss will always find a way. The tool that is best to help prevent cheating is the T. That's the only "tool" that will make a big difference. #DitchBook
A2: Tools like TurnItIn, etc. sometimes only push students to cheat harder and/or find ways to get around it. They often spend more time finding ways to beat the system than just doing the assignment themselves. #ditchbook
A4: Let's bring in student choice and personalization to allow the students voice to truly come through. They won't even think to cheat cause the product of the assessment will be off their own making. #ditchbook
A2: It catches the act, but we as Ts need to step into it and make it a teachable moment.
EG: Turnitin catches it, but Ss don't know how to fix it. #DitchBook
A2: I don’t think it really has to do with the tools. If Ss are engaged and like what they’re learning, they’ll want to work and won’t engage in cheating #DitchBook
A1: In the times that I did it back in the day, it was lack of time, lack of knowledge but still wanted the grade, and lack of interest in the subject matter (especially when I got to precalculus, sorry math folk!) #ditchbook
A2 it seems that the search for the next way to cheat continues, although the plagiarism checkers are a help, way around it is through creating more authentic, non textbook tasks, b/c most text answers are free online too #DitchBook
A1: Ss chest when they think the ‘product’ is the end game. If they see that learning continues and it’s ok to not master on the 1 test then they may be less likely to cheat. #DitchBook
A2 In the real world they will not be locked out of Google or other sites they might the answers to a quiz. They need to learn values instead of having adults controlling the environment #DitchBook
A2: If a student wants to cheat they will find a way. Sharing a document, crowd-sourced slides... always a challenge. Talk to Ss about learning only happens when you do it yourself, not when you copy or someone else does it for you. #DitchBook
A2 It makes Ss feel like they aren't trusted. It also builds more management structures into to school, making it MORE institutional. Institutions are run by managers, not empowerers. #ditchbook
A2: They hurt the issue because it just encourages the students to find a different way to cheat instead. They spend more time cheating/trying to cheat than studying and doing well. #ditchbook
A1: my opinion, students plagiarize because a) they want to finish an assignment quickly to move on to something of importance to them...like video games b) they really have no clue of the severity of what they're doing c) rarely get called them on it #DitchBook
A.2 Ss who really want to cheat will find a way and will spend time finding other ways to cheat. Although I do appreciate the plagiarism checkers.#ditchbook
Love #Ditchbook but strongly disagree here. I find cheating occurs in an indirect proportion to the quality of relationship the teacher has w/ the student, regardless of the excellence of the instruction. Students who respect their teachers & feel known by them cheat less often
A2: for the first few times, it usually helps pretty well, after that, students figure out how to get around things because they are slick and deserve the credit for being smarter than often given #ditchbook
But what is “cheating?” Some people might consider it being #Innovative or #UsingResources. Is it about reciting information or finding and implying information that is readily available. #DevilsAdvocate#DitchBook
I'm trying to understand this fear... Fear of... Work? Fear of being creative? Fear of brain output? Fear of failure. :( Makes me want to reframe learning in the classroom as an opportunity to grow. Ss should not be afraid to fail.
#ditchbook
A2: #Ditchbook I try to "fix" the issue by making grades as much about the process as the final result...must show your "work"/thinking/rationale to get credit for an answer...higher DOK Q's, too.
A2 you can’t force change in behavior. The individual has to want to do it the right way for it to be impactful. It is our job to make sure our expectations are relevant to each individual student #DitchBook
I loved algebra, trig, geometry, once I got to precalc, I was completely lost, took trig and prob & stats in college to avoid calc and get my math credits #ditchbook
100% -- students cheat because THEY CAN and IT'S EFFICIENT. That's the way we run our schools. We need more assignments that kids can't just cheat on. Authentic and reflective of interest. #ditchbook
I find the same thing w/ some of my Ss. It's our job though to educate them on the difference if no one else has. Getting caught cheating/plagiarizing in college or the real-world could be detrimental. #DitchBook
fear of everything you mentioned. To me they seem to do it because they don't want to tap the inner potential they have and are content with what they know. Or anything to use their cell phone. #DitchBook
A3: I agree, but this goes both ways. I'm in a 1-to-1 school, and my rule is that I don't answer "Google-able" ?s. I do this to make Ss more self-sufficient and indirectly show them how to conduct quick, and worthwhile, searches. Underrated skillset for Ss! #DitchBook
A1: Student that cheat are focused on the end result, not necessarily the learning that should have taken them there. There are any number of reasons for this, teachers have ask them selves what role they play in this problem. #ditchbook
A3: We can ask them, but they should not be the main objective of the learning. The main objective should be something students must dig in to deeper. #ditchbook
A3 - Well...yes, I agree...but we should also ask questions they can google. Knowledge is still important. Knowing stuff is still important. IMO, anyone who believes "if they can google it, we shouldn't be teaching it" is wrong. #ditchbook
A3: Almost always. I suppose there are times where Googleable facts/dates are necessary, but asking students to create and discuss are usually more critical #ditchbook
Q2: Sometimes the tools are created as a response to CHEATING not to the CAUSE of the cheating. Students are then not empowered, not feeling confident in their abilities, and managing the obstacle course of “tools,” that having added more to their perceived problems. #DitchBook
A3: yes and no. For example in math, students need to know how to do the procedure, BUT it is also important for students to learn the concept behind the procedure and how to apply the procedure in real context #DitchBook
A3 AGREE AGREE AGREE. There's a reason Google is basically a verb now. Much of the content students need is available with a simple search. Let's make it more about what they do with that content, what they create, how they communicate it, etc. #ditchbook
A3. I think we need to teach Ss how to ask all kinds of questions. It depends on your objective. They need to learn how to use tools to answer questions as well as answer higher level questions. They also need to be taught how to ask questions. #ditchbook
I am LOVING these insights about cheating in tonight's #DitchBook chat.
Can't wait to go back through responses ...
FYI: Watch https://t.co/k3H4V95Ymn for a recap of tonight's chat. We'll curate tweets from each question!
A3: I'm kind of on the fence on this one. On one hand, you want students to know how to be skilled Google searchers, but on the other hand, you want them to explore higher DOK level responses by using that research. #ditchbook
A3: I completely agree. This is difficult in an ELA class mostly bc of the obsession with the cannon. Switch it up and teach a variety of texts. Ditch the whole class novel and offer variety or Ss choice! Less incentive to cheat with ownership and variety! #DitchBook
A3: If I want critical thinking, then I create problems that aren't a one google search and done question. However, I learn by Google all the time, so I teach Ss to Google anything that helps us get to the problem solving. #DitchBook
Always I say...I’ll never remember it if I can google it! What’s the point? I want to think, not regurgitate. Let’s ask our kids to do the same! #DitchBook
A3: It depends on what is being learned. DOK 1 info is always Google-able, but DOK 3/4 should not be Google-able to an extent.
It surprises me when Ss are go "How do you know that?" and it seems like basic information. #GoogleGeneration#Retention#DitchBook
A2) now wait, as teachers should we wait to use the tools to catch kids... or should we show the kids how to use the same tools. They can catch themselves, edit their work and make it their own. #DitchBook
A3: Agree to an extent. Pretty soon there won't be any question Google can't answer. Plus, if Google can't answer it, their 1,000 Snapchat friends can. #ditchbook
Tools lull teachers into a false sense of security and they don't change their practices. They should instead make kids get excited about the learning and be invested in their work so they won't think of cheating. #DitchBook
Many of my Ss want "google-able" questions/answers and get frustrated when I ask them to think deeper. It's a daily goal of mine to push them. I think it's very important! #ditchbook
I don't think it's that we shouldn't be teaching it if it can be Googled. It's about what we're expecting from our teaching. Memorization and recall of facts have little value long-term. I don't believe we should be teaching w/ those goals in mind! #DitchBook
#ditchbook A3 Any straight-up 'rule' on my teaching is like a professional painter hearing a straight-up 'rule' on paintings. Don't judge my teaching performance on the trendiest teaching advice you just heard and stick around long enough to see the painting...if you must judge.
And sometimes trying to avoid being in trouble when it's constantly hanging over your head is incredibly stressful. We also make the kids that don't cheat feel that way with all the tools we use to fight the ones that do. #ditchbook
A3 Knowing how to formulate the right questions to learn from Google is an important skill too. That being said we need to form better questions as educators that students need to discuss and show evidence of their learning #DitchBook
A3: we should ask questions that you can’t JUST Google the answers to. We have to take into account the outcomes and strategies before we proceed with the tools and the planning of our lessons. #DitchBook#BoldSchool
A3: Part of me agrees that we should challenge our students to truly prove they have learned, but at the same time, since when has my supervisor told me to do something but I can't look anything up or get assistance? #ditchbook
A3 Amen! Students have so much information that we cannot imagine how tough it is compared to our education. Start asking questions that gets them thinking at a higher DOK level. And if they can Google the Answer is there a real reason to memorize it? #Ditchbook
A3: I think it is okay to have some answers googleable, but then they need to go deeper with the material and make connections that cannot be found on the internet. #ditchbook
A3 I think sometimes it is helpful to get a quick answer, like looking for a resource, title of a book, basic knowledge or uncommon fact even, but need to push Ss to explore more and not be able to find an answer, #DitchBook
A4. I am not sure they need to be different rather teach Ss about this and how to put things into their own words. If no one teaches them how will they know? #ditchbook
A3: In elementary math, this would be tough. There are skills students need to be able to do (at least according to curriculum) and most of these could be googled. #DitchBook
A3: Agree, in that we should pose students with questions that require their own thoughts, perspectives, and expressions. Disagree, in that students should learn how to use the tools they have greatest access to, responsibly and to their greatest advantage. #DitchBook
A3: Questions should be asked that have no answer.Students today are going to face diverse problems. Allow Ss to do some problem-solving and logical thinking to real world scenarios. Have them create ideas backed up with evidence. Teach authentic problem solving.#ditchbook
A4: How do we battle cheating, the copy/paste variety or others?
We have to be willing to "kill our darlings."
We LOVE those activities, but are they getting results anymore?
Taking a risk and trying something new could reap great rewards. #DitchBook
Truth. And how much learning comes out of that? If, as teachers, we get REAL about the amount of learning that comes from these assignments, we can do DIFFERENT activities that cause kids to think. Not just fill in blanks. #DitchBook
Indeed! When I started assessing writing with Ss on chromebooks, I had to change my assessments because they had access to all of their prior thinking...and Google. I realized that I needed higher DOK! End result? Deeper thinking. #ditchbook
A2: for the first few times, it usually helps pretty well, after that, students figure out how to get around things because they are slick and deserve the credit for being smarter than often given #ditchbook
A2. I have given students access to online resources to help find info not part of standard curriculum. However they forget the way to properly use them. And they don't give credit for using them. #DitchBook
A3: Saw this chat on my stream and had to jump in. :-) Great chat #ditchbook! Shouldn't Ss be able to crawl b4 they can walk...meaning they have to know how to find information as a basis for synthesizing it. Nothing wrong with Google answers if it leads to original creations.
When my 5th grade accelerated son gets frustrated I get excited!! I usually say something like... “yes!!! I see your brain sweating! Get after it!” #DitchBook
Q4: Ss should be given opportunities to create products of value. I recently asked Ss to design pieces of tech using AI dino friends as inspiration & create an instruction manual. Cheating was virtually impossible. Blog here for any interested https://t.co/xrJTg2ZQEj#DitchBook
A4: Give the students some voice/choice in the activities/assignments. When kids have ownship or a stake in their learning, they give it value. They value the PROCESS more than the PRODUCT. #ditchbook
A4 open ended, I am loving #pbl and also doing things like #hyperdocs , have Ss come up with their own product to show learning, create their own story, etc. #ditchbook
EXACTLY. Really, in many cases, it's a product of the culture. What do we value?
To see what we really value, you have to see what we REWARD -- and how we reward it. THAT will change everything. #DitchBook
A4: Activities/assignments that can't be graded w/ a simple answer key tend to be difficult to cheat on in math/CS classes at least. Maximizing S choice and working in S interests also helps! #DitchBook
A4: I think it all goes back to being a student-centered classroom. If the project can be structured to allow students some freedom to choose what they do and be creative, I think cheating would drastically be reduced. #ditchbook
A4 Project-based learning. Asking students to explain their thinking. Teaching it to others. Those will show us if they learned the content and if they can apply it. #DitchBook
A3: You could Google just about anything, but we need to teach students to dig deeper with their searches and use better sources. It's D
Digital Citizenship stuff that needs to be taught at the elementary level. Ethics. MS or HS is too late. #ditchbook
At that point, no....not cheating. But if it's independent work/quiz/test/etc and they are copying the answer just to finish asap then I consider that cheating. #DitchBook
A3: I'm OK with having students learn things they can Google.
I'm NOT OK with valuing their ability to regurgitate those facts over actually THINKING. #DitchBook
So true -- and sometimes kids need to plagiarize a few times to know how to accurately source. It can be tricky working with information on the internet, but that's why it's so important we teach Ss those skills. #ditchbook
A4: Also, give challenges that require Ss to use their skills. My Ss went through a Romeo & Juliet escape room & used skills learned to escape. This included Makey Makey locks. Ss didn't want to cheat bc they wanted to enjoy the experience & they wanted to win! #DitchBook
A4: In MI, our state assessments are moving to almost all claim, reason, evidence for literacy and science. This will help students with their thinking and explain that as long as they can do those three for their thinking, that will help. #ditchbook
A4: Include more engaging assignments. Let students be creators, make them explain why things are they way they are, give them work they excited about. #DitchBook
But even still some of the activities I believe are engaging, students are cheating and finding shortcuts to save time to not have to work instead. #DitchBook
A4: Giving Ss options to help them stay engaged. The more variety for assignments they have the better! Open-ended projects could really help this issue! #DitchBook
There's real value to this ... get to a higher DOK level. We have to build the foundation with the basic competencies, too, but push to those higher levels as well. #DitchBook
Show our kids relevance. Just like rules...we don’t create them to ensure dominance, it’s typically for safety. Now...demonstrate the reason behind the activity - if you can’t, re-evaluate #DitchBook
A4: Design original activites that don't have canned answers, like the #CaptionThis with Google Slides. That isn't Googleable. Or raps with vocabulary. There are TONS of things to deepen the learning. #PBL is one. Google and searches / research will play a part. #DitchBook
A4: We live in a new world. If we really want to change this cheating problem, it will require a huge shift in education practices & structures. MUCH smaller class sizes, a LOT of one-on-one time w/ students, & more time to plan, create, & prepare feedback. #ditchbook
A4: I strongly believe in student choice in showing knowledge. Let them create an authentic, real-world applicable product which they can "personalize" discourages cheating and encourages effort. #ditchbook#studentvoice
A4: One of my favorite ways was to change the point of view students looked at an issue to a unique perspective. Also to have them connections to current events an happenings in the world or in their life. #DitchBook
A4 Ask kids to make things, solve problems, thinking critically about what we're studying, ASK questions rather than answer them. If we are simply asking them to recite facts and regurgitate data, then we might as well let them cheat. #ditchbook
A3: I'm OK with having students learn things they can Google.
I'm NOT OK with valuing their ability to regurgitate those facts over actually THINKING. #DitchBook
A4: Empower students to create, not regurgitate. Allowing students more time to explore, play, and experiment with concepts with a focus on GROWTH, not GRADE. #DitchBook
BOOM. This is KEY.
"It's impossible to be creative with information you don't have."
We want kids thinking at high levels, but we have to build to that higher level with a solid foundation. #DitchBook
