#ASEchat Archive

The Association for Science Education (ASE) promotes excellence in science teaching and learning. Follow #ASEchat Mondays at 3pm ET.
Monday February 6, 2017
3:00 PM EST
  • participatechat Feb 6 @ 3:00 PM EST
    Participate in the upcoming #ASEchat by sharing resources and collaborating at https://t.co/mKOeusFf0N
  • edubabbIe Feb 6 @ 3:00 PM EST
    Through this lived experience, children build upon the quality of higher education. #asechat
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:00 PM EST
    It was the norm when I started in 1986 Integrated sci was where it was at! #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw, @teacherchalky1
  • gregtheseal Feb 6 @ 3:00 PM EST
    only one way to find out #ASEchat.
    In reply to @DrWilkinsonSci, @ViciaScience
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:00 PM EST
    I think that after a few years Ts should be expected to be able to teach all 3 up to KS4 #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:01 PM EST
    #ASEChat welcome to this evening's chat on ITE in science, with me @edujdw from Sussex @SussexUni
    In reply to @edujdw, @SussexUni
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:01 PM EST
    Exactly! I am a fan of 'leaf discs' to avoid translocation issues #ASEChat
    • gregtheseal Feb 6 @ 3:00 PM EST
      only one way to find out #ASEchat.
      In reply to @DrWilkinsonSci, @ViciaScience
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:02 PM EST
    There's loads of support out there and if schools have a tailored NQT/RQT programme its er do-able #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:02 PM EST
    me too! But I've changed my mind since. I think we ask too much given the differences in disciplines #ASEChat
    In reply to @oboelizzy, @teacherchalky1
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:02 PM EST
    Hi. Is tonight's #ASEChat for primary teachers as well?
    In reply to @edujdw, @SussexUni
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:02 PM EST
    Might miss some of #asechat, on my way home from Zumba!
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:02 PM EST
    agree completely - Ive had a complete 360 change over last few yrs #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw, @teacherchalky1
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:02 PM EST
    do-able yes (I've done it, but is our attraction to the '3 sciences' ideologically flawed? #ASEChat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:03 PM EST
    Can you name 'the five disciplines'? I can think of five under 'biology' #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw, @oboelizzy, @teacherchalky1
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:03 PM EST
    Because Science isn't usually split into separate Sciences #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:03 PM EST
    My researcvh into science education reveals that the 'golden age of '3 sciences' was no such thing #ASEChat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:04 PM EST
    Use hole punch or cork borer to make 5mm discs, float in bicarb solution. #ASEChat
    In reply to @gregtheseal
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:04 PM EST
    maybe however it should be part of a Science TS CPD #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:04 PM EST
    it was simply that those were the O levels available leading to A level then university, but university has changed #ASECHAT
    In reply to @teacherchalky1
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:04 PM EST
    #asechat can we include what we think ought to be in ITE for primary colleagues as well tonight?
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:05 PM EST
    Perhaps it is time to put a stop to the artificial BPC categories at secondary? #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw, @teacherchalky1
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:05 PM EST
    yet that's what the government wants ideally hence the seprate science ITE funding. #ASEChat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:05 PM EST
    I like teaching BCP, but most confident teaching Physics #asechat - what are the other two you're including?
    • edujdw Feb 6 @ 2:59 PM EST
      we wouldn't normally expect a humanities teacher to teach 5 disciplines so why science? #asechat
      In reply to @teacherchalky1
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:05 PM EST
    #asechat we need to look at ITE and CPD as a complete continuum not separate things
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:06 PM EST
    the five major B,C,P, Geol, Astro, but yes there are many many disciplines in reality #ASEChat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @oboelizzy, @teacherchalky1
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:06 PM EST
    Leaf disc experiment via @SAPS_News #ASEChat
    In reply to @gregtheseal, @SAPS_News
  • gregtheseal Feb 6 @ 3:06 PM EST
    how long do you think they will need to be kept in the dark for? 24h #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:06 PM EST
    it is a bit different at school, but now we have quantum biology ... #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw, @teacherchalky1
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:07 PM EST
    It was hell being a biologist in 70's - hair dressing and nurses - few male students #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw, @teacherchalky1
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:07 PM EST
    @DrWilkinsonScino, we have to train to 2 key stages so could be KS3 and 4 5 often very limited by schools @teacherchalky1 #ASEChat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:07 PM EST
    #asechat an important component of ITE should be pri and sec learning about each other-all the time!
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:07 PM EST
    ahhh. :) #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw, @ViciaScience, @oboelizzy, @teacherchalky1
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:07 PM EST
    geology and astronomy #ASEChat
    In reply to @A_Weatherall
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:08 PM EST
    thought so... #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • mrsjmclark Feb 6 @ 3:08 PM EST
    I think ideally teachers should be allowed to focus on their specialisms but difficult to always make fit with timetable. #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:08 PM EST
    Astro nearly missed from current GCSE due to clerical error! #ASEChat #canyouseeit?
    In reply to @edujdw, @oboelizzy, @teacherchalky1
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:08 PM EST
    and even these are just the 'major' disciplines we could add in psychology #ASEChat
    In reply to @A_Weatherall
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:08 PM EST
    If we didn't though how many options would there have to be? #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @edujdw
  • DrWilkinsonSci Feb 6 @ 3:09 PM EST
    Strangely, as a researcher I saw no BCP segregation, yet post (C) ITT it took a while to regain my confidence in B&P knowledge #ASEChat
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:09 PM EST
    its a complex issue this one-because there is so much overlap conceptually and philosophically #asechat
    In reply to @mrsjmclark, @edujdw
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:09 PM EST
    The ages of science #asechat https://t.co/7AT0bWjADB
    • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:03 PM EST
      My researcvh into science education reveals that the 'golden age of '3 sciences' was no such thing #ASEChat
      In reply to @teacherchalky1
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:09 PM EST
    That’s an interesting perspective #asechat Hello everyone!
    • DrWilkinsonSci Feb 6 @ 3:09 PM EST
      Strangely, as a researcher I saw no BCP segregation, yet post (C) ITT it took a while to regain my confidence in B&P knowledge #ASEChat
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:10 PM EST
    I'm not sure the poor person who does the timetabling would agree #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • massignmenthelp Feb 6 @ 3:10 PM EST
    #asechat Should the toughest kids be assigned to the best teachers? https://t.co/3NhTh5TF87
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:10 PM EST
    Options? Why do we need options? Which other subject has them. #chooseat16 #ASEChat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @edujdw
  • AssignmentHelpN Feb 6 @ 3:10 PM EST
    #asechat 10 Simple Ways to Use Pinterest For Classroom Teaching https://t.co/0i2sbvZqo7
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:10 PM EST
    what if we rejigged it to teach say maths, physics and astronomy; chemistry and Earth Sci; Biology & Environmental sci? #ASEChat
    In reply to @mrsjmclark
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:10 PM EST
    Now I need to eat my tea #asechat (food science :) )
  • theASE - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:10 PM EST
    It would be great if any NQTs and new teachers can join the chat tonight - is it time to rethink teacher training? #ASEchat
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:11 PM EST
    would that be easier e.g. getting a maths/physics/astro teacher? #ASEChat
    In reply to @mrsjmclark
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:11 PM EST
    quantum biology? #asechat
    In reply to @A_Weatherall, @edujdw
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:11 PM EST
    when I worked in research prior to PGCE I was in a BioPhysicalChemistry Dept of a hospital school of medicine! #asechat
    In reply to @DrWilkinsonSci
  • gregtheseal Feb 6 @ 3:11 PM EST
    did a similar prac with blended celery soaked chads and hydrogen peroxide #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:11 PM EST
    YES! I remember that quite shoddy work! #ASEChat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @oboelizzy, @teacherchalky1
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:11 PM EST
    Not in agreement to planning a curriculum based on teacher supply #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw, @mrsjmclark
  • DrWilkinsonSci Feb 6 @ 3:12 PM EST
    Depends on definition of "specialism" too. With so many science degrees in subjects other than BCP, difficult to pudgeon hole Grads #ASEChat
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:12 PM EST
    maybe but Ts should cover it during ITT #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:12 PM EST
    but is that sufficient reason to ask so much of a physicist? They would rather teach maths I suspect than Biology #ASEChat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1
  • RequireImprove Feb 6 @ 3:12 PM EST
    Haven't seen a really integrated course since modules came in (maybe since Nuffield 13-16?) #asechat ...
    In reply to @edujdw
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:12 PM EST
    See Brian Cox 'Wonders of Life' #ASEChat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @A_Weatherall, @edujdw
  • mrsjmclark Feb 6 @ 3:13 PM EST
    I agree @oboelizzy- so much overlap. Always topics teachers feel more confident teaching - depends on their background. #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw, @oboelizzy
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:13 PM EST
    Need to be led a bit by 'big ideas' of sci and conceptual integration and coherence #asechat
    In reply to @DrWilkinsonSci
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:13 PM EST
    this is part of my point - why do we pat attention to BCP when 'real science' so very different @teacherchalky1 #ASEChat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @teacherchalky1
  • FarmStokehill Feb 6 @ 3:13 PM EST
    Do-able but not desirable - often a lack of in depth background knowledge outside the subject specialism #ASEchat
    In reply to @edujdw, @edujdw
  • MaryUYSEG Feb 6 @ 3:14 PM EST
    @edujdw are the differences in disciplines greater than the similarities #ASEChat ?
    In reply to @edujdw
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:14 PM EST
    or Jim Alkhalili's work #asechat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @edujdw
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:14 PM EST
    Conspiracy? Surely not! Just appoint three writers of the NC and see what you get #ASEChat
    In reply to @MaryUYSEG, @edujdw, @oboelizzy, @teacherchalky1
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:14 PM EST
    we'd need options because they'd have to be taught as separate qualifications as things stand now #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @edujdw
  • RequireImprove Feb 6 @ 3:14 PM EST
    ... how much is teaching out of specialism driven by staffing needs (esp for physics)? #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:14 PM EST
    I'm an earth scientist. Conspiracy! (always the hard done by subject) @ViciaScience @oboelizzy @teacherchalky1 #ASEChat
    In reply to @MaryUYSEG, @ViciaScience, @oboelizzy, @teacherchalky1
  • mrsjmclark Feb 6 @ 3:14 PM EST
    Personally I am confident teaching Biol and Chem bcs of my degree content,Physics GCSE probably okay but not KS5.#ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw, @oboelizzy
  • EduGladiators Feb 6 @ 3:15 PM EST
    🎥TONIGHT #EduGladiators Podcast is BACK! Join the 🌎 convo w/@jprofNB ⏯https://t.co/WzIJMnGeDD #ASEchat #Kinderchat #DRchat #leadupchat
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:15 PM EST
    Here is some interesting ongoing research about TS and inclusion https://t.co/qhZRdqSLJG #asechat #disadvantaged
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:15 PM EST
    We need a greater focus on 'big ideas' and conceptual integration #asechat
    In reply to @MaryUYSEG, @edujdw
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:15 PM EST
    far too much, but when I talk to physics grads they are most unhappy at teaching biol and vice versa #ASEChat
    In reply to @RequireImprove
  • theASE - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:16 PM EST
    do INSPIRE graduates stay linked into research? #ASEchat
    In reply to @jesswade, @imperialcollege
  • DrWilkinsonSci Feb 6 @ 3:16 PM EST
    #asechat
    • DrWilkinsonSci Feb 6 @ 3:15 PM EST
      I think to have a "teaching specialism" is to a) know subject b) know misconceptions c) know good T&L activities.
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:16 PM EST
    not if everyone had to study ‘science’ like they do maths, English, geography #asechat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @ViciaScience, @edujdw
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:16 PM EST
    It is not the case that your ITT experience is really only as good as the school you train in and your mentor? #ASEChat
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:16 PM EST
    I suspect that would give them limited job prospects as most schools need them to teach all three #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:17 PM EST
    OK the other way to go, BUT that would need a rethink of ITE to produce generalists rather than specialists #ASEChat
    In reply to @oboelizzy, @MaryUYSEG
  • mrsjmclark Feb 6 @ 3:17 PM EST
    In terms of timetabling I meant not possible to fit it to have a dif Biol/Chem/Physics teacher for the same set necessarily #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • DrWilkinsonSci Feb 6 @ 3:17 PM EST
    b) and c) come with experience, and as a result I do think it's unfair to ask teachers to be specialist in 3, let alone, 5 subjects #ASEChat
  • SKLchem Feb 6 @ 3:17 PM EST
    #asechat How do schools offer triple science? Is it option? Totally unguided? We are offering as option this year - previously did with set1
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:17 PM EST
    How does it fit in with the curriculum though? #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @A_Weatherall, @edujdw
  • jesswade Feb 6 @ 3:17 PM EST
    there is also @RISchools- but not as much data on how long the teachers stay in teaching (not just jump back into research) #ASEchat
    In reply to @theASE, @RISchools
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:18 PM EST
    not if schools looked again at how they package their science teaching in a new 'trivium'. #ASEChat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:18 PM EST
    Yeah I know!- it is very complex-but hey so is sci and so is education! #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw, @MaryUYSEG
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:18 PM EST
    Could I commend the following reading? Options at Y8/9 is damaging https://t.co/7TmvnUUsB7 #ASEChat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @edujdw
  • fiddleBrain Feb 6 @ 3:18 PM EST
    Hmm. Scottish highschools have opposite issue: BCP-specific training despite theoretically cross-curricular curriculum #ASEChat #ScotEdChat
    • edujdw Feb 6 @ 2:49 PM EST
      #ASECHAT are we asking too much of science teachers to be 'expert' in 5 disciplines? 10 mins to go - what do you think? Join me & discuss
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:18 PM EST
    So if we are training new science teachers how can we help them do a good job? So many degrees now, is anyone a ‘specialist’? #ASEChat
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:19 PM EST
    Dont you think ITE needs a rethink?! #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw, @MaryUYSEG
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:19 PM EST
    look again at our science curriculum? it's a mishmash over revision after revision #ASEChat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @ViciaScience, @A_Weatherall
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:19 PM EST
    What should ITE look like to enable primary and secondary teachers of science have the confidence to teach science well? #ASEChat
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:19 PM EST
    Better than current quart into pint pot - allows breadth of study to 16 if just comb sc #ASEChat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @A_Weatherall, @edujdw
  • LessonToolbox Feb 6 @ 3:20 PM EST
    A Level #Biology #hexagon key word links sheet via @mrsjmclark Dwnld ➡️https://t.co/aBg7vngcQv #ukedchat #aussieEd #asechat
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:20 PM EST
    Does the ITE route make a difference to the output of QTS in science? #ASEChat
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:20 PM EST
    Extremely good question which we must address!! #asechat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:21 PM EST
    it's an issue here as well, our training is now BCP specific, but general curric. though not quite same as Scotland #ASEChat
    In reply to @fiddleBrain
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:21 PM EST
    If we were talking about the 2011 gcse curriculum the I would say, no everyone can teach all science. Now... ??? #ASEChat
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:21 PM EST
    Agree - if recruited on premise that we teach physics to 16! #ASEChat
    • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:12 PM EST
      but is that sufficient reason to ask so much of a physicist? They would rather teach maths I suspect than Biology #ASEChat
      In reply to @teacherchalky1
  • twinklresources Feb 6 @ 3:21 PM EST
    #asechat empower teachers- espec prim- to have confidence to go for it!
    In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:21 PM EST
    I think ITE needs a rethink, yes, but also not helped by the curriculum as it stands. #ASEChat
    In reply to @oboelizzy, @MaryUYSEG
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:21 PM EST
    How could that practically be done? #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:22 PM EST
    depends on the ITT route (Or ITE) #ASEChat
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • mrsjmclark Feb 6 @ 3:22 PM EST
    I think PGCEs/ITTs can be great if placement schools are supportive & recruitment of trainee teachers/mentors is done well.#ASEChat
    In reply to @theASE
  • SteveTeachPhys Feb 6 @ 3:22 PM EST
    well there's more to know & understand in the humanities! #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw, @teacherchalky1
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:22 PM EST
    QTS here means legally you can teach ANY subject regardless not so in Scotland so issue worse up there. #ASEChat
    In reply to @fiddleBrain
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:22 PM EST
    absolutely! couldn't agree more! nor is it helped by high stakes assessment! #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw, @MaryUYSEG
  • FergusonMr1 Feb 6 @ 3:22 PM EST
    Yes I agree. #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • missaudsley Feb 6 @ 3:22 PM EST
    Might actually make some of #asechat tonight! What are we talking about?
  • BHASVIC_Chem Feb 6 @ 3:23 PM EST
    It's a risk at a level to teach too far outside specialism. Many misconceptions can emerge #ASEChat
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:23 PM EST
    @edujdw Noooo! I would be a dreadful maths teacher. WHY DON'T YOU GET IT? x EQUALS 4Pi OVER 3. OBVIOUSLY #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @edujdw
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:23 PM EST
    I fear that is the case yes #ASEChat
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:24 PM EST
    I agree that the whole system needs starting again but I'm not sure about the practicalities #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw, @ViciaScience, @A_Weatherall
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:24 PM EST
    not always good for relationship building, and tracking progress between 3 teachers #wriggleroom #ASEChat
    In reply to @mrsjmclark, @edujdw
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:24 PM EST
    link maths, phys & astro;11st team; link chemistry earth science second team; biol and envirnomental 3rd team #ASEChat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1
  • Roussel_Capra Feb 6 @ 3:24 PM EST
    .@FergusonMr1 @hrogerson surely it also depends on the ST him/herself & their attitude/personality/open-mindedness/willingness,etc? #ASEChat
    In reply to @FergusonMr1, @hrogerson
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:24 PM EST
    I ask again - what can we do to encourage more discussion between pri and sec sci at ITE level?#asechat
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:24 PM EST
    teacher training #asechat
    In reply to @missaudsley
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:24 PM EST
    IoP trying combined physics and maths for teachers who dislike biology #ASEChat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @edujdw
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:25 PM EST
    That way you are asking far less of the experts but covering the disciplines. #AsecHAT
    In reply to @teacherchalky1
  • hecharden Feb 6 @ 3:25 PM EST
    I was more qualified in Maths (2xA level) than biology but my pedagogical training is sci based #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @ViciaScience, @edujdw
  • fiddleBrain Feb 6 @ 3:25 PM EST
    .@edujdw Maybe we need to support both generalists & specialists sci-teachers at diff. stages: would suit diff teachers & learners #ASEchat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • whitebug16 Feb 6 @ 3:25 PM EST
    lot of sch advertise 'science teacher' but then specify specialism in ad. am physics, wouldn't teach bio! #asechat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @edujdw
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:25 PM EST
    yes we definitely are and it is doing the pupils a disservice #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • RequireImprove Feb 6 @ 3:26 PM EST
    Depends. I teach physics as a native tour guide. Biology, I do my best, but I'm a visitor. Thought styles too different. #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:26 PM EST
    I have only taught biology 3 years out of 14. And what's to dislike? #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @edujdw
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:26 PM EST
    given how little time we have 1 subject, but still have to cram loads in as 'extras' for survival #ASEChat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • hecharden Feb 6 @ 3:26 PM EST
    ..but is the pedagogical requirements the same? #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @hrogerson, @edujdw
  • GWC_Biology Feb 6 @ 3:26 PM EST
    Map of Science - worth a look for those planning integration of science curricula #ASEChat https://t.co/EjsoiI2MUi
  • Roussel_Capra Feb 6 @ 3:26 PM EST
    .@oboelizzy primary team came to do a session on KS1/KS2 Science and transition and I did some sessions on science teaching #ASEChat
    In reply to @oboelizzy
  • jesswade Feb 6 @ 3:27 PM EST
    the @PhysicsNews , @RoyalSocBio + @RoySocChem run teacher training for "non-specialists" #ASEChat
    In reply to @fiddleBrain, @edujdw, @PhysicsNews, @RoyalSocBio, @RoySocChem
  • mrsjmclark Feb 6 @ 3:27 PM EST
    Brilliant video of protein synthesis modelling activity submitted by yr 12 pupils.#ASEChat #scichat #ALevel #Biology https://t.co/dtFrTZdxCn
  • mrsjmclark Feb 6 @ 3:27 PM EST
    This looks brilliant! Where did you get the examples from or did you make the resource? #ASEChat
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:27 PM EST
    hmm, really? Five full science disciplines and different ways of working and skills? #ASEChat @teacherchalky1
    In reply to @SteveTeachPhys, @teacherchalky1
  • PearsTom Feb 6 @ 3:27 PM EST
    I am of an institution which runs a primary and secondary PGCE. Would love to interact with primary TTs, doesn't happen! #asechat
    In reply to @oboelizzy
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:27 PM EST
    Not practical on our course! Primary in what we were out and vice versa. #asechat
    • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:24 PM EST
      I ask again - what can we do to encourage more discussion between pri and sec sci at ITE level?#asechat
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:27 PM EST
    even how you 'do' physics practical work is VERY different from biology loads to learn just there #ASEChat @teacherchalky1
    In reply to @SteveTeachPhys, @teacherchalky1
  • HGourlayUEA Feb 6 @ 3:28 PM EST
    For some. But note attrition rate for sci teachers higher than other subjects. #asechat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @edujdw
  • marshychemist Feb 6 @ 3:28 PM EST
    as a chemistry specialist I was often asked to teach physics rather than chemistry #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:28 PM EST
    A suggestion-can every ITE course require students to read and reflect on works of R.Driver, J. Osborne, P. Adey, +many others! #asechat
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:28 PM EST
    and how would it be timetabled to ensure continuity and ownership of classes #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • Roussel_Capra Feb 6 @ 3:28 PM EST
    .@mrsjmclark @edujdw perhaps the timetabling & the curriculum plan should also he addressed ? #ASEChat
    In reply to @mrsjmclark, @edujdw
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:28 PM EST
    Is the answer to extend ITE to two years (and make cert ed compulsory)? #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw, @NeedhamL56
  • PhysicsEducator Feb 6 @ 3:28 PM EST
    We have 3 sets based on KS3 SAT scores. Remainder do double. #asechat
    In reply to @SKLchem
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:28 PM EST
    link to original article https://t.co/lJ23GpUXjx #asechat @ASPIRES2science #ASEChat
    In reply to @ASPIRES2science
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:28 PM EST
    #ASEChat anyone think the bursaries are causing issues? Met trainee recently with biochem degree who admitted her Chem isn't good but £££
  • HGourlayUEA Feb 6 @ 3:29 PM EST
    two-year course to create time #asechat
    In reply to @oboelizzy
  • missaudsley Feb 6 @ 3:29 PM EST
    That would be good. I hated teaching chemistry and wondered why maths couldn't use my skills! #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @hrogerson, @edujdw
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:29 PM EST
    would it mean rotating classes round though or splitting the teaching time up during the week #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:29 PM EST
    what I'd propose is NOT short term fixes but a planned generational change so we get it right. #ASEChat @ViciaScience
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @ViciaScience
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:29 PM EST
    such a tiny proportion of ITT and a shame that all ITT don't get the same opportunities as these #asechat
    In reply to @jesswade, @theASE, @imperialcollege
  • edubabbIe Feb 6 @ 3:30 PM EST
    Educators are concerned with addressing inequity, but in other church bodies, and sponsors. #asechat
  • mrsjmclark Feb 6 @ 3:30 PM EST
    We have 120 mins of Biol/Chem/Physics at GCSE with 3 dif teachers&do build a relationship/track progress still. #ASEChat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @edujdw
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:30 PM EST
    I think unless your in a really big school you'll be in the minority #asechat
    In reply to @whitebug16, @edujdw
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:30 PM EST
    Oh Im sure I can think of very many more!! but 140! #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience
  • missaudsley Feb 6 @ 3:31 PM EST
    I think a good mentor is essential. Even if not your official one. I had a mentor who was HOD. No time to help me! #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • mrsjmclark Feb 6 @ 3:31 PM EST
    but I can see how it could be difficult, especially if a rotation system/switch teachers part way through. #ASEChat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @edujdw
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:31 PM EST
    There’s also this report from @educationgovuk https://t.co/RfgLeNPakG though some have questioned methodology #ASEChat #specialist teachers
    In reply to @educationgovuk
  • HGourlayUEA Feb 6 @ 3:31 PM EST
    people can ignore this but is that a way to solve recruitment shortage? #asechat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • theASE - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:31 PM EST
    If you're just joining us we're discussing rethinking ITE. Is there too much to squeeze in? with @edujdw #ASEchat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:31 PM EST
    yet I've heard anecdotally that Ma/Phys trained are then 'required' to teach all others so leave #ASEChat @hrogerson
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @hrogerson
  • Roussel_Capra Feb 6 @ 3:31 PM EST
    .@FergusonMr1 @hrogerson indeed they will, not a clear cut scenario. many variables at play including time allocation at Uni/Schls #ASEChat
    In reply to @FergusonMr1, @hrogerson
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:32 PM EST
    I think that we do need to look at teacher progression of knowledge during their first five years of teaching. #ASEChat
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:32 PM EST
    for all children? do lower ability cope well with this model? #ASEChat
    In reply to @mrsjmclark, @edujdw
  • HGourlayUEA Feb 6 @ 3:32 PM EST
    No. physics *with* maths = predominantly physics. #ASEChat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @hrogerson, @edujdw
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:32 PM EST
    Long term I think bursaries are damaging retention and building false hopes. #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw, @hrogerson
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:33 PM EST
    mmmm its a rock and a hard place #ASEChat
    In reply to @HGourlayUEA
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:33 PM EST
    definitely-said earlier-need to look at ITE and CPD as a continuum-not 1st 5 yrs but for ever! I still learning! #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:33 PM EST
    I agree even as an earth scientist, but many physicists hate biology #ASEChat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @ViciaScience
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:33 PM EST
    It's too easy to say 'teach X, Y, Z' during the ITE year, as if it's possible to learn everything immediately. #asechat
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:33 PM EST
    depends, if you want them to be a finished product at end of 1yr then there is far too much, should be a journey #ASEChat
    In reply to @theASE, @edujdw
  • FergusonMr1 Feb 6 @ 3:33 PM EST
    Definetly a lot of variables. And also huge variety in trainees too. I love mentoring ITT/PGCE #ASEChat
    In reply to @Roussel_Capra, @hrogerson
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:33 PM EST
    The problem with generational change is that we have a general election every 4 years #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw, @ViciaScience
  • theASE - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:33 PM EST
    Absolutely! And beyond? #ASEchat our work on the professional learning journey aims to address this
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • hecharden Feb 6 @ 3:34 PM EST
    As chem specialist,what I really needed on my PGCE was practical training in physics and biology. Content OK to learn. #asechat
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:34 PM EST
    no, eg physics tends to be more deductive biology inductive diff pedagogic demand #ASEChat @ViciaScience @hrogerson
    In reply to @hecharden, @ViciaScience, @hrogerson
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:34 PM EST
    I know, call me cynical.... And I'm sure not all of them sit reading quantum mechanics books of an evening for fun.. #ASEChat
    In reply to @staffdb66
  • HGourlayUEA Feb 6 @ 3:34 PM EST
    in a world of physics shortage surely better to deploy specialist on physics where possible? #ASEChat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @ViciaScience, @edujdw
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:34 PM EST
    Secondary ITE could learn from primary? We need science specialists at primary, so why not in secondary too? #ASEChat
  • stevethedoc1 Feb 6 @ 3:34 PM EST
    #asechat or not enough put on! Met NQT recently who had one hour of primary science lecture on course, now teaching 1.5 hours a week!!!!!!!
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:34 PM EST
    hearing this a lot. 'Can't think of anything to do with your degree? Kill time and earn 25k' #ASEchat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @edujdw
  • PearsTom Feb 6 @ 3:34 PM EST
    Summer SKEs are often offered. Not all are good. Mine was fantastic, interested to know other TTs perspectives? #ASEchat
    In reply to @theASE
  • marshychemist Feb 6 @ 3:34 PM EST
    I ws lucky to have supportive colleagues with good advice but in some schls students only get bio teachers #ASEChat
    In reply to @hecharden, @edujdw
  • fiddleBrain Feb 6 @ 3:34 PM EST
    that’s great, important earlier broad “inspiring” science teaching, esp.to improve STEM uptake, is recognised #ASEchat
    In reply to @jesswade, @edujdw
  • hecharden Feb 6 @ 3:35 PM EST
    When I taught lower sets shared two teachers #asechat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @mrsjmclark, @edujdw
  • missaudsley Feb 6 @ 3:35 PM EST
    True, I just wanted to teach physics and maths, rather than bio or chem. No experience of them beyond dual award GCSE #asechat
    In reply to @staffdb66
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:35 PM EST
    I've really enjoyed teaching phys even tho I'm a bio as it's caused me to look out of the box #asechat
    In reply to @broomesci, @edujdw
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:35 PM EST
    but if the ITE training for a ma/phys/astro teacher was specific? #ASEChat @hrogerson @ViciaScience
    In reply to @CurlyMan66, @hrogerson, @ViciaScience
  • stevethedoc1 Feb 6 @ 3:35 PM EST
    #asechat perhaps a properly organised 3 year mentor programme!!
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:36 PM EST
    & it is excellent, but schools are devoid of cash to support it well. #ASEChat @fiddleBrain @PhysicsNews @RoyalSocBio @RoySocChem
    In reply to @jesswade, @fiddleBrain, @PhysicsNews, @RoyalSocBio, @RoySocChem
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:36 PM EST
    Yes, unfortunately too many 'in power' think generic leadership training is sufficient. #asechat
    • theASE - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:33 PM EST
      Absolutely! And beyond? #ASEchat our work on the professional learning journey aims to address this
      In reply to @hrogerson
  • twinklresources Feb 6 @ 3:36 PM EST
    what a lovely thought #asechat
    In reply to @stevethedoc1, @hrogerson
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:36 PM EST
    @jesswademany teachers now get NO CPD due to lack of funds #ASECHat not set to get better @fiddleBrain @PhysicsNews @RoyalSocBio @RoySocChem
    In reply to @fiddleBrain, @PhysicsNews, @RoyalSocBio, @RoySocChem
  • hecharden Feb 6 @ 3:36 PM EST
    I think this is a very good point. Is it A-levels rather than degree that are key to what people teach? #asechat
    In reply to @missaudsley, @staffdb66
  • SteveTeachPhys Feb 6 @ 3:36 PM EST
    well yeah, maths is just that thing you have to know to be able to do Physics! #ASEChat
    In reply to @HGourlayUEA, @ViciaScience, @hrogerson, @edujdw
  • DrWilkinsonSci Feb 6 @ 3:36 PM EST
    Went to rebook, but nothing south of Congleton in the next year!! If there's such a shortage of Physics teachers, why not more CPD? #ASEChat
  • Roussel_Capra Feb 6 @ 3:37 PM EST
    .@doc_kristy @staffdb66 ha! But they might re-watch Feynman on youtube a gazillion times to claim they've read the FLoP #ASEChat 🤔🙃😀🖖
    In reply to @doc_kristy, @staffdb66
  • stuartphysics Feb 6 @ 3:37 PM EST
    These type of 2 year masters courses are now being introduced in Scotland e.g. https://t.co/tY9cnWPz8c … #asechat
    In reply to @HGourlayUEA, @oboelizzy
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:37 PM EST
    and I wonder if demand is too high to be multi-specialists #ASEChat @teacherchalky1
    In reply to @HGourlayUEA, @teacherchalky1
  • missaudsley Feb 6 @ 3:37 PM EST
    .@doc_kristy can't believe how much they pay people to train to teach physics. Then they take pay drop to do NQT? yeh right.. #asechat
    In reply to @doc_kristy
  • stevethedoc1 Feb 6 @ 3:38 PM EST
    #asechat done in parts of US, partly sponsored, why not here?
    In reply to @twinklresources, @hrogerson
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:38 PM EST
    Where is the QA of the diversification of teacher education courses? #asechat or do Teaching Schools have first picks?#schooldirect
    • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:29 PM EST
      such a tiny proportion of ITT and a shame that all ITT don't get the same opportunities as these #asechat
      In reply to @jesswade, @theASE, @imperialcollege
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:38 PM EST
    Do need continued development into HoF for science, e.g. H&S. how many explosions on school fiends this year? #asechat
  • scallyrascal Feb 6 @ 3:38 PM EST
    I would love more physics CPD! I love it! I have staff chomping at the bit to do a conversion course but no luck at finding them #ASEChat
    • DrWilkinsonSci Feb 6 @ 3:36 PM EST
      Went to rebook, but nothing south of Congleton in the next year!! If there's such a shortage of Physics teachers, why not more CPD? #ASEChat
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:38 PM EST
    We must bring pri colleagues back in to this discussion-this affects us all (and HE @doc_kristy) Must see this as continuum #asechat
    In reply to @doc_kristy
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:38 PM EST
    ideally yes and if 2 Yr would be a PGDip this is what TF are doing #ASEChat @NeedhamL56
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @NeedhamL56
  • FergusonMr1 Feb 6 @ 3:38 PM EST
    I came from Scottish system when I did only Chem and Phys ditched Bio at end of KS4 #asechat
    In reply to @hecharden, @missaudsley, @staffdb66
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:38 PM EST
    Me too. #asechat (or did)
    • CurlyMan66 Feb 6 @ 3:36 PM EST
      would make sense, personally I like teaching PCB, I like the interconnectivity of the three disciplines
      In reply to @edujdw, @hrogerson, @ViciaScience
  • HGourlayUEA Feb 6 @ 3:38 PM EST
    and some have more interdisciplinary degrees than others #ASEChat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56
  • whitebug16 Feb 6 @ 3:39 PM EST
    ditto as a Phys...very little experience of e.g. dissection as MY Bio teacher opted out #asechat even now I get stuck in and hope!
    • hecharden Feb 6 @ 3:34 PM EST
      As chem specialist,what I really needed on my PGCE was practical training in physics and biology. Content OK to learn. #asechat
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:39 PM EST
    did IoP not try? #asechat
    In reply to @stevethedoc1, @twinklresources
  • TJohns85 Feb 6 @ 3:39 PM EST
    #asechat I did Marine Bio at uni and am happy teaching more chem and phys now.I know of some biologists that refuse to teach phys
    In reply to @edujdw
  • fiddleBrain Feb 6 @ 3:39 PM EST
    .@edujdw @PhysicsNews @RoyalSocBio @RoySocChem apart from funding (CPD is oft free in cash, not time) what are the other barriers? #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw, @PhysicsNews, @RoyalSocBio, @RoySocChem
  • FergusonMr1 Feb 6 @ 3:39 PM EST
    I have taught GCSE Bio, with mentoring, and pupils got good results #asechat
    In reply to @hecharden, @missaudsley, @staffdb66
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:39 PM EST
    put your best teachers on these groups? #progress #ASEChat
    In reply to @SKLchem, @hecharden, @mrsjmclark, @edujdw
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:39 PM EST
    until recently I've taught more Phy than anything else even though I'm a biologist #asechat
    In reply to @oboelizzy, @broomesci, @edujdw
  • SteveTeachPhys Feb 6 @ 3:39 PM EST
    well ok some of them make themselves useful by teaching stats for the Biologists #ASEChat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @HGourlayUEA, @hrogerson, @edujdw
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:39 PM EST
    I had better declare an interest in this #asechat discussion as I am also a subject specialist mentor for RSC ITT scholarship programme
  • FergusonMr1 Feb 6 @ 3:40 PM EST
    Subject knowledge takes you so far, pedagogy and skill as a teacher important IMHO #asechat
    In reply to @hecharden, @missaudsley, @staffdb66
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:40 PM EST
    Cannot believe can attain QTS without PGCE #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw, @NeedhamL56
  • SKLchem Feb 6 @ 3:40 PM EST
    #asechat Re. ongoing training after ITT & NQT - I learned such a lot from attending ASE conferences; most on Sat too!
  • carroll_dr Feb 6 @ 3:40 PM EST
    There's some great maths to be learnt through biology too #ASEChat
    In reply to @SteveTeachPhys, @HGourlayUEA, @ViciaScience, @hrogerson, @edujdw
  • hecharden Feb 6 @ 3:40 PM EST
    Dissection is a very good example of what I never had training in. As NQT bio colleague guested in my lesson! #asechat
    In reply to @whitebug16
  • stevethedoc1 Feb 6 @ 3:41 PM EST
    #asechat not really, needs a nationally recognised/ expected programme
    In reply to @hrogerson, @twinklresources
  • HGourlayUEA Feb 6 @ 3:41 PM EST
    Arguably in some areas the maths IS the physics (Feynman paraphrased) #asechat
    In reply to @SteveTeachPhys, @ViciaScience, @hrogerson, @edujdw
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:41 PM EST
    Am I right in thinking primary science gets a day during a pgce course and is grateful for that? #ASEChat
  • stuartphysics Feb 6 @ 3:41 PM EST
    I did Physics and Maths PGCE over 30 years ago. Seems more natural to me than Phys and Bio #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @hrogerson, @edujdw
  • broomesci Feb 6 @ 3:42 PM EST
    Why is the degree classification the determining factor for bursary amounts? Coming from a 1st class graduate #ASEChat
  • missaudsley Feb 6 @ 3:42 PM EST
    I think it indicates you like the subject, which is a great starting point. #asechat
    In reply to @hecharden, @staffdb66
  • mrthomson Feb 6 @ 3:42 PM EST
    Anyone got any good resources/ideas for teaching Fertilisation to some Year 7s? #asechat
  • hecharden Feb 6 @ 3:42 PM EST
    Agreed. Lots to learn via @thease conference. Great practical session at Annual Conf #ASEChat
    In reply to @theASE
    • SKLchem Feb 6 @ 3:40 PM EST
      #asechat Re. ongoing training after ITT & NQT - I learned such a lot from attending ASE conferences; most on Sat too!
  • DrWilkinsonSci Feb 6 @ 3:42 PM EST
    Yup 2 of us ready to go at our school… we're ready @PhysicsNews, we're ready @theASE, we're ready @STEMLearningUK. Get courses on! #ASEChat
    • scallyrascal Feb 6 @ 3:38 PM EST
      I would love more physics CPD! I love it! I have staff chomping at the bit to do a conversion course but no luck at finding them #ASEChat
      • DrWilkinsonSci Feb 6 @ 3:36 PM EST
        Went to rebook, but nothing south of Congleton in the next year!! If there's such a shortage of Physics teachers, why not more CPD? #ASEChat
  • HGourlayUEA Feb 6 @ 3:42 PM EST
    interestingly there may be a reason why physics teachers cluster in certain schools #asechat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @edujdw
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:42 PM EST
    I can't imagine how you begin to learn what you need for primary when I think of that compared to science, which is big enough. #asechat
    • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:41 PM EST
      Am I right in thinking primary science gets a day during a pgce course and is grateful for that? #ASEChat
  • TJohns85 Feb 6 @ 3:42 PM EST
    I have heard of some just doing it for a year to get the money. #asechat money talks!
    In reply to @doc_kristy
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:43 PM EST
    education not only about the results tho, not just here to get kids through exams #ASEChat
    In reply to @FergusonMr1, @hecharden, @missaudsley, @staffdb66
  • missaudsley Feb 6 @ 3:43 PM EST
    passion for the subject, you would hope. :-) #asechat
    In reply to @staffdb66, @hecharden
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:43 PM EST
    #ASEChat agreed!
    • scallyrascal Feb 6 @ 3:41 PM EST
      Development at all stages is key! It's helped me with each promotion! But if more CPD is available for each stage=better all round!
  • stevethedoc1 Feb 6 @ 3:43 PM EST
    #asechat not even that much on some courses, have known just one hour
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:43 PM EST
    QTS is the professional not academic qual anyway so can gain QTS with PG cert or dip (School Direct) #ASEChat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @NeedhamL56
  • stuartphysics Feb 6 @ 3:43 PM EST
    Pretty much in many cases. #asechat 25% of Finnish primary teachers have M level qualification in maths or sci education.
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • HGourlayUEA Feb 6 @ 3:43 PM EST
    it's not that hard to timetable even in normal comp sch #ASEChat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @edujdw
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:43 PM EST
    what proportion of new teachers would have this qualification in science? #asechat does it make a difference in Qual?
    In reply to @edujdw, @ViciaScience
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:44 PM EST
    whoops! Field!! #ASEChat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @cleverfiend
  • Roussel_Capra Feb 6 @ 3:44 PM EST
    of course, but they might need confidence & support, even those w/ phys degrees. A-level not that easy 😀 #ASEChat
    In reply to @staffdb66, @doc_kristy
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:44 PM EST
    Get in cotact with the IOP as they employ pll to come in for free or at least they used to? #asechat
    In reply to @scallyrascal
  • scallyrascal Feb 6 @ 3:44 PM EST
    I think to enhance transition Ks2 ambassadors could work collaboratively WITH Ks2 teachers rather than one off insets or projects! #ASEChat
  • missaudsley Feb 6 @ 3:44 PM EST
    I'm just bitter that I didn't get it ;-) #asechat
    In reply to @broomesci, @doc_kristy
  • hecharden Feb 6 @ 3:44 PM EST
    Who mentored you? Sounds good idea? #asechat
    In reply to @FergusonMr1, @missaudsley, @staffdb66
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:44 PM EST
    Primary do a good job of teaching 'Working scientifically' which disappears when confronted by triple science courses #ASEChat
    • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:38 PM EST
      We must bring pri colleagues back in to this discussion-this affects us all (and HE @doc_kristy) Must see this as continuum #asechat
      In reply to @doc_kristy
  • DrWilkinsonSci Feb 6 @ 3:44 PM EST
    A day! Is that right @PriSciEarle? #ASEChat
    In reply to @PriSciEarle
    • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:41 PM EST
      Am I right in thinking primary science gets a day during a pgce course and is grateful for that? #ASEChat
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:44 PM EST
    @carroll_dryes, that stats on ecology can be very useful. #ASEChat many bio grads unused to that in ITE though @SteveTeachPhys @HGourlayUEA
    In reply to @SteveTeachPhys, @HGourlayUEA
  • dannynic Feb 6 @ 3:45 PM EST
    #asechat on the Scitt courses i do it varies from 4 days to 8 days of primary science.
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:45 PM EST
    Wow! #ASEChat
    • stuartphysics Feb 6 @ 3:43 PM EST
      Pretty much in many cases. #asechat 25% of Finnish primary teachers have M level qualification in maths or sci education.
      In reply to @hrogerson
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:45 PM EST
    I took a pay cut to teach, PhD stipend was more than unqualified teacher scale point 1 (I did salaried GTP) #asechat
    In reply to @missaudsley, @broomesci
  • DrDav Feb 6 @ 3:45 PM EST
    Colleague told me he has to watch out for 'TT tourists' when recruiting via Schools direct. #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson, @ViciaScience, @edujdw
  • scallyrascal Feb 6 @ 3:45 PM EST
    I like to model is. Kids are sperm and eggs, in the play ground... great sperm race! Some spearm have odd quirks too! #ASEChat
    • mrthomson Feb 6 @ 3:42 PM EST
      Anyone got any good resources/ideas for teaching Fertilisation to some Year 7s? #asechat
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:45 PM EST
    But then your more experienced Ts get burnt out? #asechat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @SKLchem, @hecharden, @mrsjmclark, @edujdw
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:46 PM EST
    physics and maths PGCE is available now... We had one relatively recently #ASEChat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @MaryUYSEG
  • missaudsley Feb 6 @ 3:46 PM EST
    yes, I did too - from a nice nuclear industry job, after postgrad work. #asechat
    In reply to @doc_kristy, @broomesci
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:46 PM EST
    Absolutely! Yet only 10% GCSE Bio exam is maths #ASEChat
    In reply to @carroll_dr, @SteveTeachPhys, @HGourlayUEA, @hrogerson, @edujdw
  • HGourlayUEA Feb 6 @ 3:46 PM EST
    varies from provider to provider. Has anyone researched it? #ASEChat
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • stuartphysics Feb 6 @ 3:47 PM EST
    And nature of school curr structure and ITE courses mean those not specialising have much more sci contact than here #asechat
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:47 PM EST
    few but Teach First is going that way. Quality wise diff to say, but may help retention long term perhaps #ASEChat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @ViciaScience
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:47 PM EST
    We've got more physicists than the other 2 and they have to teach all 3 #asechat
    In reply to @HGourlayUEA, @edujdw
  • FergusonMr1 Feb 6 @ 3:47 PM EST
    The converse is I have seen people with amazing SK who struggle. #ASEChat
    In reply to @doc_kristy, @hecharden, @missaudsley, @staffdb66
  • JulieBrown01 Feb 6 @ 3:47 PM EST
    #ASEteachmeets can be great for informal CPD #ASEChat and courses at @STEMLearningUK for more formal
    In reply to @STEMLearningUK
    • SKLchem Feb 6 @ 3:40 PM EST
      #asechat Re. ongoing training after ITT & NQT - I learned such a lot from attending ASE conferences; most on Sat too!
  • scallyrascal Feb 6 @ 3:47 PM EST
    Course not.. but ultimately if kids get the best grades for them they have more doors of opportunity remaining open for them #ASEChat
    • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:43 PM EST
      education not only about the results tho, not just here to get kids through exams #ASEChat
      In reply to @FergusonMr1, @hecharden, @missaudsley, @staffdb66
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:48 PM EST
    will more TF stay if experienced this Qualification? Is there some data anywhere? #retention #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw, @ViciaScience
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:48 PM EST
    So do you share classes then? #asechat
    In reply to @HGourlayUEA, @edujdw
  • scallyrascal Feb 6 @ 3:48 PM EST
    Will do thanks! #ASEChat
    • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:44 PM EST
      Get in cotact with the IOP as they employ pll to come in for free or at least they used to? #asechat
      In reply to @scallyrascal
  • hecharden Feb 6 @ 3:48 PM EST
    At @theASE Annual Conference met HOS who were being asked to timetable non science teachers in their departments #asechat
    In reply to @theASE
  • MaryUYSEG Feb 6 @ 3:49 PM EST
    there is a PGCE in maths & physics. Don’t know numbers & success @charlesmtracy ? #ASEChat
    In reply to @stuartphysics, @ViciaScience, @hrogerson, @edujdw, @charlesmtracy
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:49 PM EST
    grade boundaries are broad, an A grade with a dash of inspiration is better than an A grade without in my book #ASEChat
    In reply to @scallyrascal
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:49 PM EST
    ASEteachmeets just the best! going to 1 tomorrow at Sponne in Towcester #asechat any northamptoners around?
    In reply to @JulieBrown01, @STEMLearningUK
  • HGourlayUEA Feb 6 @ 3:50 PM EST
    early career physics specialist https://t.co/BEc6pNAWpY worth contacting abt primary? #ASEChat
    In reply to @twinklresources, @hrogerson, @stevethedoc1
  • hrogerson Feb 6 @ 3:50 PM EST
    Hearing about this more often too. #asechat
    • hecharden Feb 6 @ 3:48 PM EST
      At @theASE Annual Conference met HOS who were being asked to timetable non science teachers in their departments #asechat
      In reply to @theASE
  • scallyrascal Feb 6 @ 3:50 PM EST
    Some do a good job, depends on the focus of numeracy and literacy! Also if done well it does have gains with new Req practicals #ASEChat
    • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:44 PM EST
      Primary do a good job of teaching 'Working scientifically' which disappears when confronted by triple science courses #ASEChat
      • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:38 PM EST
        We must bring pri colleagues back in to this discussion-this affects us all (and HE @doc_kristy) Must see this as continuum #asechat
        In reply to @doc_kristy
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:50 PM EST
    reckon it still goes back to A levels.... #ASEChat (or equivalent, Highers etc)
    In reply to @staffdb66, @FergusonMr1, @hecharden, @missaudsley
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:50 PM EST
    We know this doesn’t always translate into a great teacher. BUT Places like Finland have all ‘masters’ profession #PISA #asechat
    • broomesci Feb 6 @ 3:42 PM EST
      Why is the degree classification the determining factor for bursary amounts? Coming from a 1st class graduate #ASEChat
  • AJTF71 Feb 6 @ 3:50 PM EST
    I think we should do H&S training in Sept every year CLEAPPS info amazing #ASEChat
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:50 PM EST
    no data as it's only just starting, my hunch is that longer better training would help retention #ASEChat @ViciaScience
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @ViciaScience
  • FergusonMr1 Feb 6 @ 3:50 PM EST
    Problem is communicating and also very knowledgeable on very narrow area. #asechat
    In reply to @staffdb66, @doc_kristy, @hecharden, @missaudsley
  • FergusonMr1 Feb 6 @ 3:51 PM EST
    Not as if AQA GCSE B,P or C likely to have been a struggle for them. #asechat
    In reply to @staffdb66, @doc_kristy, @hecharden, @missaudsley
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:51 PM EST
    I am fairly sure you are right there #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw, @NeedhamL56, @ViciaScience
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:51 PM EST
    By coincidence @theASE in Yorkshire have a #teachmeet 28 February #ASEChat
    In reply to @JulieBrown01, @STEMLearningUK, @theASE
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:51 PM EST
    also try your local @ogdentrust science officer, they have twilight courses in my area #asechat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @scallyrascal, @ogdentrust
  • HGourlayUEA Feb 6 @ 3:52 PM EST
    schs use various models. Some do carousels of classes. Some 9 lessons per 2 week: 3B, 3C, 3P #ASEChat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @edujdw
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:52 PM EST
    it probably doesn't yet. But it's an example of biology and physics not being separate #asechat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @ViciaScience, @edujdw
  • FergusonMr1 Feb 6 @ 3:52 PM EST
    Knowledge of spec KS4/5, KS3 curriculum etc more important IMO. Takes time to build #asechat
    In reply to @staffdb66, @doc_kristy, @hecharden, @missaudsley
  • missaudsley Feb 6 @ 3:52 PM EST
    Yes, agree. I was quite shocked at first at how simple I had to go. Soon caught up #asechat
    In reply to @FergusonMr1, @staffdb66, @doc_kristy, @hecharden
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:52 PM EST
    My feeling is that our ITE dfoes not match our curriculum and neither's 'fit for purpose' - we need a national long-term plan (1/2) #ASEChat
  • MarcNeesam Feb 6 @ 3:52 PM EST
    Looks like I missed a good #ASEChat - was at @CharteredColl event in Cambridge
    In reply to @CharteredColl
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:53 PM EST
    takes a lot of time, often time that isn't available, hit the ground running! #ASEChat
    In reply to @FergusonMr1, @staffdb66, @hecharden, @missaudsley
  • scallyrascal Feb 6 @ 3:53 PM EST
    I have a non science teacher teaching ks3,he is phenomenal!He is experienced and a behavioural specialist! Happy to learn too #ASEChat
    • hecharden Feb 6 @ 3:48 PM EST
      At @theASE Annual Conference met HOS who were being asked to timetable non science teachers in their departments #asechat
      In reply to @theASE
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:53 PM EST
    And we must change ITE so that the teachers we train meet the needs of the curriculum (2/2) #ASEChat
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:53 PM EST
    Low recruitment to offer of P4NS courses, Schools not letting people out for CPD. best SKE offer has disappeared #conversion #asechat
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:53 PM EST
    But then who takes responsibility for the progress of the class? #asechat
    In reply to @HGourlayUEA, @edujdw
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:53 PM EST
    degree/PhD not that important compared to A levels, can have 1st class &struggle #ASEChat
    In reply to @FergusonMr1, @staffdb66, @hecharden, @missaudsley
  • scallyrascal Feb 6 @ 3:54 PM EST
    To be fair grade boundaries are so up in the air I don't think many know which way to go! But I agree! Bring on the flare! #ASEChat
    • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:49 PM EST
      grade boundaries are broad, an A grade with a dash of inspiration is better than an A grade without in my book #ASEChat
      In reply to @scallyrascal
  • stuartphysics Feb 6 @ 3:54 PM EST
    Agreed, and help with status more generally #asechat
    In reply to @edujdw, @NeedhamL56, @ViciaScience
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:54 PM EST
    I ditched it at end of KS3 - Standard Grades #asechat
    In reply to @FergusonMr1, @hecharden, @missaudsley, @staffdb66
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:55 PM EST
    Lack of (practical) subject knowledge growing concern as degrees > more specialist. Then need PCK on top of SCK. #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:55 PM EST
    I agree, I was bullied by a 2nd i/c sci because he thought I was "too clever" even before I started #asechat
    In reply to @FergusonMr1, @DrWilkinsonSci
  • missaudsley Feb 6 @ 3:55 PM EST
    agree. Someone send me to a history classroom! :-) Wld love that :-) #asechat
    In reply to @doc_kristy, @FergusonMr1, @staffdb66, @hecharden
  • teacherchalky1 Feb 6 @ 3:55 PM EST
    but then which teacher is accountable for their results? #asechat
    In reply to @HGourlayUEA, @edujdw
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:56 PM EST
    me too, I actually did teach a term of y7 French about 8 years ago #ASEChat
    In reply to @missaudsley, @FergusonMr1, @staffdb66, @hecharden
  • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:56 PM EST
    will we ever get acceptance of a longer training course? (Other countries do this) #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw, @oboelizzy, @ViciaScience
  • stuartphysics Feb 6 @ 3:56 PM EST
    And many people know someone who had a granny that smoked 40 a day and live to 90. Dosen't mean it is recommended. #asechat
    In reply to @scallyrascal
  • TBS_DWE Feb 6 @ 3:56 PM EST
    Let me know Boss when you find out!! @scallyrascal #ASEChat
    In reply to @scallyrascal
    • scallyrascal Feb 6 @ 3:38 PM EST
      I would love more physics CPD! I love it! I have staff chomping at the bit to do a conversion course but no luck at finding them #ASEChat
      • DrWilkinsonSci Feb 6 @ 3:36 PM EST
        Went to rebook, but nothing south of Congleton in the next year!! If there's such a shortage of Physics teachers, why not more CPD? #ASEChat
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:57 PM EST
    the student should be accountable for their results? #asechat
    In reply to @teacherchalky1, @HGourlayUEA, @edujdw
  • theASE - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:57 PM EST
    Just 3 mins to go - Any final q's for @edujdw #ASEchat
    In reply to @edujdw
  • oboelizzy Feb 6 @ 3:57 PM EST
    we must keep pushing for it #asechat
    In reply to @NeedhamL56, @edujdw, @ViciaScience
  • A_Weatherall - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:57 PM EST
    say what? ;) #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @teacherchalky1, @edujdw
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:58 PM EST
    Any moves to make teaching more of a profession, with expectation of PD, must be grasped #ASEChat
    • NeedhamL56 - Moderator Feb 6 @ 3:56 PM EST
      will we ever get acceptance of a longer training course? (Other countries do this) #ASEChat
      In reply to @edujdw, @oboelizzy, @ViciaScience
  • scallyrascal Feb 6 @ 3:58 PM EST
    I think that's a bit harsh. I have known many good scientists who can't communicate with kids. I still prefer people who can teach #ASEChat
    • stuartphysics Feb 6 @ 3:56 PM EST
      And many people know someone who had a granny that smoked 40 a day and live to 90. Dosen't mean it is recommended. #asechat
      In reply to @scallyrascal
  • missaudsley Feb 6 @ 3:58 PM EST
    I've got 5 shades of green colouring pencils ready to go! :-) #onlyjoking #asechat
    In reply to @ViciaScience, @A_Weatherall, @teacherchalky1, @edujdw
  • doc_kristy Feb 6 @ 3:59 PM EST
    recently met a number of PE teachers teaching science, thankfully they were coming to TeachMeet so able to get some help #ASEChat
    In reply to @hrogerson
  • edujdw Feb 6 @ 3:59 PM EST
    no, students are RESPONSIBLE for results, teachers are accountable for what they teach. #ASEChat @teacherchalky1 @HGourlayUEA
    In reply to @A_Weatherall, @teacherchalky1, @HGourlayUEA
  • ViciaScience Feb 6 @ 3:59 PM EST
    Yes. Looking forward to report in couple of years. Needs more than just 'practical skills' needs scientific thinking too #ASEChat
    In reply to @edujdw